63 replies to this topic

[Danny Linguini]

I’ve had my SSE DX 5” since November, and I’ve gotten to use it (at night) a whopping two times. First night out the conditions were decent, second time was just crappy all around - partly cloudy and very heavy dew on everything. I had a devil of a time keeping it aligned, for some reason - I aligned it on Jupiter, but then every time I’d head for another target, I got ‘in the neighborhood’ and then needed that awful red dot finder to zero in. And like you, if I moved the scope just a little too fast, it lost its place much more easily than I expected it would. Seemed like I spent more time waiting for it to find its bearings than actually viewing anything, especially the second night when you could barely see any stars. I haven’t had a decent night above 20° F in over a month, and probably won’t now until spring. I don’t recall such a long stretch of cloudy nights as I’ve seen since I got this scope. But bottom line is, I just haven’t had enough quality time with it to make a good assessment. 

[Nightskyman]

Out of curiosity, could the StarSense dob be used in another mount?

[BrentKnight]

Out of curiosity, could the StarSense dob be used in another mount?

Since the only unique part of the StarSense Dob is the cradle, and that's moved around quite a bit when people put them on their own scopes, there should be no reason you couldn't move the whole OTA to a new base.

 

Is the base on the Dobs that bad for motions?

[JohnnyBGood]

I bought a SSE 80 for myself for Christmas to try one out (and eventually give it to my oldest son to upgrade his ST70) and I have been very impressed with the technology. The mechanics of the rest of the scope needed some help, like a mount tuneup, some shims and whatnot, and I'm working on replacing the spreader and useless eyepiece tray. But the SSE feature? Outstanding. Works fine with my Pixel 5a, although with the case on my phone when I adjust the "stage" to align the phone camera with the mirror the case presses against the red dot finder rendering it useless. Of course, the RDF isn't at all necessary so it's not really a problem.

The first night I had it out, I had my 11 year old son come play with. After about 2 minutes of explaining how to use it and a couple trial runs lining it up on things like the Orion nebula and Jupiter that he knew how to find on his own he successfully found several objects he'd never tried to find before (the three open clusters in Auriga).

While I'm a bit ambivalent about the scope finding things for me since I'm a old school type who likes sitting down with a chart and a red flashlight to find things the hard way with as little help as possible, I have to admit that's the most excited I've seen my son get about using a telescope. He went on to find half a dozen other things before getting cold and going back inside.

I worry that it makes it too trivially easy to find things and thus can cause someone to lose interest because they can very quickly "see everything there is to see". On the other hand, the world is changing and not everyone likes doing things the hard way. If it gets more people looking up then it's a good thing.

I like the fact there there is a curated list in the phone app for things to see, both easy and challenging. I don't like the fact that it doesn't give you a realistic idea what to expect because some of the objects were mostly invisible in my somewhat light polluted skies and I couldn't differentiate them from regular background stars. It has the locations of many, many more objects built in so you can also pan around and tap on something on the screen and line up on it and take a look. You may not actually be able to see whatever it is, though, since it may be fainter than your sky background.

By the second night out I had it aligned better and had learned to simply trust it. If it said the object was in the eyepiece then it was if I looked long and hard enough.

Like Ed, I think these would have to be my #1 recommendation for people (especially those with kids) from now on. I'm likely going to get one for my father as well so he can have an easier time finding things to see without having to stop over looking through a finder scope as much. Good for young people and older people with bad backs.

[aeajr]

Note there are 3 different mounts in the line.

LT. LIGHT WEIGHT and cheap. Not highly recommended.

DX starts at the 100mm refractor. Fairly stable and we'll matched to the scopes. Have slow motion controls. Recommended

Dobsonian. Also recommended

All of the scopes are pretty good EXCEPT the 114 mm Bird Jones. Avoid that one.

Edited by aeajr, 10 January 2023 - 03:18 PM.

[BrentKnight]

Note there are 3 different mounts in the line.

LT. LIGHT WEIGHT and cheap. Not highly recommended.

DX starts at the 100mm refractor. Fairly stable and we'll matched to the scopes. Have slow motion controls. Recommended

Dobsonian. Also recommended

All of the scopes are pretty good EXCEPT the 114 mm Bird Jones. Avoid that one.

It is the cheapest of the bunch though and if all you want is the adapter/software key to mount on another Dob, it's the one to get (just toss the rest?).

[Second Time Around]

In the UK the 80mm refractor is a little less than the 114mm Bird-Jones.

There's also a 70mm f/10 refractor on the LT mount available in Europe. It's lighter and shorter than the 80mm, but on the same mount and so is more stable.

What's more the 70mm is only £169 vs £229 for the 80mm.

To their credit First Light Optics don't sell any Bird-Jones scopes.

[RobertMaples]

It is the cheapest of the bunch though and if all you want is the adapter/software key to mount on another Dob, it's the one to get (just toss the rest?).

The 80 lists for $10 less than the 114.  I have seen the114 priced less on occasion, but usually not.  Even if the 114 was less than the 80, I  can't see getting it unless it was significantly less, even if just getting it for the StarSense.  The 80 is very good optically - if one really don't have any use for it, it can be sold for some money back or even give away as an at least usable scope.

[BrentKnight]

I see on Amazon right now that the 114 is less.  Regardless, these low priced options are the best way to go if you don't need the mount or the telescope.  Get whichever is cheapest.  Compared to physical encoders and a dedicated computer like the Nexus, they are a steal either way.

 

The red-dot finder is also pretty marginal, but I did salvage it and put it on my ETX-105 to replace it's really lousy finder scope.

[Nightskyman]

How do you tell how tight should the adjustment knob for altitude should be and/or how much is too much? Asking because  not sure how much to tighten to hold position.

[JohnnyBGood]

How do you tell how tight should the adjustment knob for altitude should be and/or how much is too much? Asking because not sure how much to tighten to hold position.

Which model scope? In general for the LT mount I keep the knobs just tight enough that the scope doesn't move on its own when I let go. This does mean I have to make frequent adjustments tighter or looser as I move the scope to different elevations.

[Nightskyman]

Johnny, it is the 8” dob

[Nightskyman]

I e feel certain that the issue is not my phone as it works fine when pointing most directions but south. So far, there doesn’t seem to be as many stars to the south when I am out around 8:00pm so I’ll make a point of going out later as they move to see if that helps. I am also not clear if it depends on the number of stars seen by 5he naked eye but I assume that is likely what it sees. I don’t understand what plate solving is.

[UTSkyWatcher]

I recently purchased the exact same scope and I have had issues with the software as well.

As other members have stated in this and other posts on the SSE tech, it does seem that iPhones work great but Android Phones are hit or miss.

My Pixel 6a would not work at all but my old Pixel 3XL works great.

Once I got it out with my 3XL on a mostly clear night, the app worked great for me in every direction. I agree that if you move your scope quickly it does complain about not knowing where it's pointing. Once it tells me where to point I have had no issues in pointing the scope where the app says and then it's and to figure out where it's pointing again and the object is either in the fov or **** close.

[BrentKnight]

Plate solving will take a very short exposure (I'm not sure how long StarSense is). That is enough for the phone camera to see more than naked eye.

Plate solving uses data about the star positions in the sky to locate where it's pointing. It is able to recognize patterns such as triangles of stars and their relative positions to each other. From this information it knows the coordinates of the image the camera has captured. As you move the telescope, the camera takes more pictures and has to figure out where it is again. It can be very accurate when used for AP, a little less so for visual use with the StarSense.

For it to work with the movement of your telescope, the phone has to know where it's pointed and if it's actually moving - and it has to get that from it's internal sensors (accelerometers, GPS, compass). If those are slow, or inaccurate, it will take additional time for the phone to catch up to the plate-solved image.

[JOEinCO]

....I see on Amazon right now that the 114 is less. Regardless, these low priced options are the best way to go if you don't need the mount or the telescope. Get whichever is cheapest....

 

Any version will do if you're only after the widget. Be sure to watch Craigslist! The cheapest model seems to show up most, perhaps because the mount is disappointing at best and astronomy interest soon wanes. I picked up an LT 80AZ off Craigslist for a song.

 

I made this simple base plate out of a 1/4" Baltic Birch ply scrap, and attached a Synta-style rail section I had to the bottom. Easy peasy, and now it fits any scope with a standard ol' accessory shoe...

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[Andrea Salati]

Buying a used one from some disappointed newbie is a great idea but not devoid of risks as the code can be used only for a limited amount of times, at least this is what I understood when I investigated a couple of months ago.

[Anony]

Buying a used one from some disappointed newbie is a great idea but not devoid of risks as the code can be used only for a limited amount of times, at least this is what I understood when I investigated a couple of months ago.

Based on what I have read, if you contact Celestron and say you need a new code, they will give you one. I expect they'll want some proof that you actually own a starsense scope, but pretty sure those buying used without a code can still get a code.

[Andrea Salati]

Good to know, thank you!

[Nightskyman]

After 2 months, finally had a great experience with the StarSense technology. I think the secret is having a REALLY clear sky!

[drago6817]

I hope I can bring a a helpful perspective as a complete newbie who bought a starsense explorer DX 102AZ to see the "green comet" I kept seeing on the news. The comet turned out to be less than compelling but I'm keeping the scope anyway as it's been a wonderful experience looking at everything else I didn't even know was up there. For example, the object I choose to calibrate it too on the first night, which was the brightest object in the direction I happened to be facing, turned out to be Jupiter and seeing it and it's moons so clearly for the first time with my own eye was absolutely incredible and something I'll never forget.

 

As for the star sense technology itself, I personally think it's great for a complete newbie like myself. I've been able to find everything I've tried looking for with it easily, including the meh comet and even Uranus tonight(it was listed in the "challenging" section of the app so I was pretty proud of myself). One of the things I love about the app is it tells me what is out there and viewable each night(including difficulty) as I don't really know the night sky yet. 

 

I use a note 9 android phone. I have a magnet in my normal phone case and I noticed I have much better luck with the inertial app guidance when I take my phone out of it's case and calibrate the compass before installing it into the starsense cradle. Before I figured this out the inertial guidance wasn't very accurate and I would have to wait for the app to calibrate itself to what it was seeing in the sky before it was accurate again after movements. Now I can pretty much move to an object and even when I get the message that the app sensed fast movement and is finding itself in the night sky again, the object I was looking for will be in the eyepiece even before the app has found itself. Also before I figured this out there were a few instances where the app completely lost itself (I live in a pretty light polluted area) and I had to point it a bright pattern of stars for it to correct itself (I used Orion's belt area). This hasn't happened since I learned to remove my case and re-calibrate the compass (I think the magnet makes this necessary).

 

For the initial calibration I just choose something bright and align to it with the red-dot finder (I had to align this the first night but now it's bang on for the initial app calibration or pointing quickly to anything easy to find) then center it in the eyepiece and zoom into it on my phone in the app. I bought a zoom eye-piece so I zoom in and re-center on the object before doing the final adjustment on the app o to get it aligned perfectly. 

 

Reviewing everything else from a newbie's perspective:

 

Scope: Great, I can see the bands on Jupiter which exceeds what I though was possible. I'm sure it's not the best in the grand scheme of things but as a newbie it's everything I wanted optically. I think there is some chromatic aberration as when I'm extremely zoomed in on bright objects there will be a bright violet "halo" around them, but it doesn't seem to be a huge problem yet for viewing things. The focus mechanism is probably my biggest complaint on the scope as it's pretty coarse, with small knobs meaning that the difference between perfectly clear and blurry can be an almost imperceptible movement. My focuser was also a bit stiff so I re-greased it(stock grease was ultra tacky like glue) and adjusted the tension to free it up which helped a bit(don't make it too loose or the tube will be too loose in the scope and allow play). I may try the peanut butter lid mod for the focuser next.

 

Tripod: This is actually the part I have the most complaints about. It's fine at lower magnifications but it tends to "resonate" at the slightest touch of the scope at high magnification. This makes focusing very difficult and compounds with the problem of the coarse focuser noted above. It's very hard to focus when everything is wiggling. I bought a 8lb "sandbell" weight that fits perfectly in the accessory tray that helped quite a bit, but it's still and issue( I think I'm going to look into hanging this weight in the future so that I can still use the tray).  I also tightened both axis and the tripod legs, which also helped some. Most of the remaining vibration seems to be in the "head" of the tripod, and I'm still looking into ways to mitigate this(next I'm trying to add larger diameter bronze washers to where the legs attach to the head as stock there are small diameter plastic "lands" cast into the clevises that the tripod seems to be able to rotate about somewhat.) The slow motion controls are awesome though and I am grateful I have them. I actually don't know how I could keep things in frame at high magnification without them. The tripod is the part I'm most dissatisfied with and keep trying to improve(and have seen the biggest improvements in from mods/adjustments). It's definitely still quite functional though, even if it's a bit frustrating at times.

 

Staresense Cradle: Great no issues, holds my phone and is adjustable enough to center my camera. Very little play in the mechanism once attached. Not much else to say.

 

Eyepieces: The included eyepieces don't seem to be too bad, but I wish a Barlow was included. I'm not sure what type they are but they were clear enough (actually clearer than a cheap chinese "plossl" I picked up on Amazon at the same time.) I've since bought a SVbony 7-21 zoom eyepiece and use this almost exclusively now(it's GREAT, and because it's not parfocal it allows me another way to fine tune focus). I also bought a small array of barrows(2X is my most used), cheap eye pieces(skip these and just get the zoom SVbony or equivalent) and filters (Favorites: the light pollution filter works well in my area, and a 14% moon filter is REQUIRED for the moon and made Jupiter a much better viewing experience) which I recommend doing as the two included eye-pieces are pretty limiting.

 

Overall newbie experience: 9/10

 

Newbie take away: - Shows me things I didn't even know existed, but I wish it would stop wiggling when I'm trying to focus.

[RobertMaples]

...I have a magnet in my normal phone case and I noticed I have much better luck with the inertial app guidance when I take my phone out of it's case and calibrate the compass before installing it into the starsense cradle. Before I figured this out the inertial guidance wasn't very accurate and I would have to wait for the app to calibrate itself to what it was seeing in the sky before it was accurate again after movements. Now I can pretty much move to an object and even when I get the message that the app sensed fast movement and is finding itself in the night sky again, the object I was looking for will be in the eyepiece even before the app has found itself. Also before I figured this out there were a few instances where the app completely lost itself (I live in a pretty light polluted area) and I had to point it a bright pattern of stars for it to correct itself (I used Orion's belt area). This hasn't happened since I learned to remove my case and re-calibrate the compass (I think the magnet makes this necessary)...

Good point about the magnet and calibrating the compass.  I don't think the documentation mentions either of those anywhere and it's probably something many users won't think of.

 

 

...The slow motion controls are awesome though and I am grateful I have them. I actually don't know how I could keep things in frame at high magnification without them...

Slow motion controls can make a world of difference on an otherwise difficult to use mount.

[Nightskyman]

How did you calibrate the compass?

[JeffreyC]

 

 

Tripod: This is actually the part I have the most complaints about. It's fine at lower magnifications but it tends to "resonate" at the slightest touch of the scope at high magnification. This makes focusing very difficult and compounds with the problem of the coarse focuser noted above. It's very hard to focus when everything is wiggling. I bought a 8lb "sandbell" weight that fits perfectly in the accessory tray that helped quite a bit, but it's still and issue( I think I'm going to look into hanging this weight in the future so that I can still use the tray).  I also tightened both axis and the tripod legs, which also helped some. Most of the remaining vibration seems to be in the "head" of the tripod, and I'm still looking into ways to mitigate this(next I'm trying to add larger diameter bronze washers to where the legs attach to the head as stock there are small diameter plastic "lands" cast into the clevises that the tripod seems to be able to rotate about somewhat.) The slow motion controls are awesome though and I am grateful I have them. I actually don't know how I could keep things in frame at high magnification without them. The tripod is the part I'm most dissatisfied with and keep trying to improve(and have seen the biggest improvements in from mods/adjustments). It's definitely still quite functional though, even if it's a bit frustrating at times.

 

 

Try to use in a seated position, with the tripod legs as short as possible to mitigate vibrations.  Anti-vibration pads also help, but don't expect miracles.  A 5lb metal dumbbell weight will sit flat on the tray and allow you to still use the tray.  One of the most effective mods to reduce vibrations is to replace the stock 4" dovetail plate with a 7" plate, so you can balance the OTA.

[RobertMaples]

How did you calibrate the compass?

I don't know about iPhones, but with Androids you just kind of wave the phone around in a figure 8 pattern.  I don't remember off hand if you have to be in an app that uses the compass or not (such as the SatrSense app), but it's not a bad idea to be in one when you do it to make sure.