8 replies to this topic

[Brad Templeton]

I have a variety of scopes in the 12lb to 15lb range, such as a 120mm APO, and 8" SCT and a 6" Ritchey-Chretien

 

And I use them, one at a time, on my CG5.   Not the most expensive mount but it's reasonably sturdy and can do short-exposure astrophotos.  It's already pretty bulky to take around and set up.

 

But times come which I wish I could mount 2 of my scopes, for example to have one with a camera and one for eyepiece work, or for short-duration events like the recent occultation of Mars where I want both of us to be able to observe at the same time with a good scope.

 

But it seems that the mount market is all lower-priced mounts that can't handle this amount of weight without a lot of wobble, even for observing, or >$1,000 mounts which are heavy duty and good for astrophotography.

 

If I were a more serious astrophotographer I would buy something better than the CG-5, though it would probably not be easy to transport.  (I live in Bortle 8!)

 

My ideal would be a heavy duty Alt-Az mount with computerized tracking capable of about 20lbs -- small, not too hard to set up, good for observing but not photography.

 

I guess a CG-4 might barely handle the weight, and you can get that very cheap, especially the Orion version ($140 at High Point?) but probably pushing it and no clock drive so things drift out of view fast enough.

 

Now I don't really use the Astronomics Ritchey-Chretien and probably will sell it, since a 6" R-C is not really ever going to outdo a much more expensive 120mm APO refractor or an 8" SCT, even as an astrograph. At least not this one.  Though it is the smaller scope and so could be the more portable observing one to grab and go with.

 

Or do I need to plunk down at least $700 or so to get something here (more than I paid for the CG-5 long ago.)    I guess if I found somebody selling the fork for the Meade LX-200 that would do the job, but I got it used as on OTA for just $300 because why not?

[ris242]

Just as a point of interest ......but not for the mounts you're mentioning.......

 

My CEM 26 is perfectly fine as a portable for my 90mm 500 and my 102 FL-1122mm visually, but there is no way I would attempt a 8" SCT at 2032mm focal length as any wobble would be double that, of the 102mm scope.

[hcf]

My ideal would be a heavy duty Alt-Az mount with computerized tracking capable of about 20lbs -- small, not too hard to set up, good for observing but not photography.
 
I guess a CG-4 might barely handle the weight, and you can get that very cheap, especially the Orion version ($140 at High Point?) but probably pushing it and no clock drive so things drift out of view fast enough.

The only $140 mount I see at high point, is the EXOS Nano, which is much weaker than the CG-4 with its 1.25" legs (no matter what the payload specs say).

 

If you are willing to give up on computerized tracking on the Alt-Az mount, there are options like the M002C (M2C) or the SkyTee 2. The look somewhat similar, but differ in presence of slow motion knobs, ease of adding encoders etc.

 

Encoders could be a replacement for PushTo vs a computerized GoTo. No tracking though.

 

If you are into hobby electronics you could try converting one of these to GoTo using ONSTEP.  See here for an example.

 

https://onstep.group...n/message/43909

Edited by hcf, 06 February 2023 - 12:31 AM.

[Wildetelescope]

I have a variety of scopes in the 12lb to 15lb range, such as a 120mm APO, and 8" SCT and a 6" Ritchey-Chretien

 

And I use them, one at a time, on my CG5.   Not the most expensive mount but it's reasonably sturdy and can do short-exposure astrophotos.  It's already pretty bulky to take around and set up.

 

But times come which I wish I could mount 2 of my scopes, for example to have one with a camera and one for eyepiece work, or for short-duration events like the recent occultation of Mars where I want both of us to be able to observe at the same time with a good scope.

 

But it seems that the mount market is all lower-priced mounts that can't handle this amount of weight without a lot of wobble, even for observing, or >$1,000 mounts which are heavy duty and good for astrophotography.

 

If I were a more serious astrophotographer I would buy something better than the CG-5, though it would probably not be easy to transport.  (I live in Bortle 8!)

 

My ideal would be a heavy duty Alt-Az mount with computerized tracking capable of about 20lbs -- small, not too hard to set up, good for observing but not photography.

 

I guess a CG-4 might barely handle the weight, and you can get that very cheap, especially the Orion version ($140 at High Point?) but probably pushing it and no clock drive so things drift out of view fast enough.

 

Now I don't really use the Astronomics Ritchey-Chretien and probably will sell it, since a 6" R-C is not really ever going to outdo a much more expensive 120mm APO refractor or an 8" SCT, even as an astrograph. At least not this one.  Though it is the smaller scope and so could be the more portable observing one to grab and go with.

 

Or do I need to plunk down at least $700 or so to get something here (more than I paid for the CG-5 long ago.)    I guess if I found somebody selling the fork for the Meade LX-200 that would do the job, but I got it used as on OTA for just $300 because why not?

I have used a CG4 with clock drives with a 6 inch mak.   Took very nice moon and planet images.   It is a good mount if you do not over load it.   For visual, a CG4 will support a C8.   Up to you whether the wiggles during focusing is acceptable.  Not for me, but I am really picky about that.  If that is what your budget will allow, then as long as you are patient it will work.

 

The reality is that if you want to load the mount to over 15 lbs and image with larger aperture/focal lengths, you need to spend more money. Folks are doing nice work with 50-70 mm scopes and the little GTi type mounts. but you will not put a C8 on it.  Honestly your CG 5 is probably the best combination of price and capacity/portability. 

 

JMD

[Eddgie]

 

 

Or do I need to plunk down at least $700 or so to get something here (more than I paid for the CG-5 long ago.)  

Mostly, the answer here is "Yes, you will have to spend more" unless you are willing to buy used.

 

Used iOptron MiniTower Pro will sell in your price range.  These are full Go2 with tracking and can carry two telescopes. 

 

The Az Mount Pro is better because it has built in WiFi and built in rechargeable battery , but used you can expect to pay more than $700.

 

There really isn't much out there in terms of Alt_Az goto, and the iOptrons (in my opinion)_ are the best Alt Az mounts you can buy for anything remotely close to the same dollars. 

 

Here is my Az Mount Pro. The Tripod is not stock. Without the counterweight, this weighs 22 lbs including tripod, but again, this is not the stock tripod.

 

 

You can find lots of pictures on the web where people are running dual scopes on either the Minitower Pro of the Az Mount Pro but for heavier scopes, the Az Mount Pro has much heavier duty azimuth bearing.  It also elminates issues with cord wrap due to the build in battery and the WiFi is fantastic for controlling the mount. 

 

Why would you use WiFi? The Az Mount Pro has 40,000 objects in its catalog, but suppose you see a double star on your phone app and decide you want to go to it. Finding it in a catalog can take some amount of scrolling. With WiFi, you just touch the star on your phone app and press "Go2, and the program sends the coordinates to the mount, which then slews to the target. For NCC and Messier objects, you can directly enter the catalog number on the mount handset, but for double stars an things like Shapless objects or dark nebula (most people don't look at these things), Sky Safari or some other program is the best way go get the mount to the target by sending the coordinates to the mount via Wifi.

 

 

 

The best best best time to run dual scopes is when doing sun in both Ha and white light.  I am in the process of setting my Az Mount Pro up to handle my 130mm apo on one side and my Lunt 80 on the other.  The Lunt 80 will be over the recommended weight for the second scope, but I have confidence that the mount can handle it.  

Edited by Eddgie, 06 February 2023 - 10:36 AM.

[Eddgie]

For a 120mm refractor you would likely need to get the semi-pier which simply bolts between the mount and the tripod hub. 

 

New Tripod weighs 10 lbs . About 24 lbs total with the semi-pier and mount but no counterweight.  Does not get much lighter than Az Mount Pro or MiniTower Pro and still give you Go2. 

 

Scope is 20 lbs. 

 

 

 

[Brad Templeton]

Thanks.  Some interesting options here.    I should note that a couple people thought I was trying to go for a two-telescope mount.  I am not.       I mean it's an interesting option, but not something to pay more for.  The main mount will carry the main scope and do photography, the 2nd mount would carry another telescope and be visual only.

 

As I am sure most people know, it's nice to easily find things, and nice to keep them in the field.     If you want photography, an EQ is usually the way to go, but alt-az is cheaper and more convenient.

 

I may just keep looking for some of these mounts used.   Right now any of the good options cost more than the spare telescopes did, and we'll only do this two-scope thing on rare times.

 

As I noted the recent Mars occultation was a good example.   A bit south of me it was a gazing one.    So you could watch it graze for 14 minutes, not vanish for 15 seconds.    I thought that would make a cool movie -- though with Mars only 10 seconds in diameter not as good as it might be.  But in that case I would not get to see it with another large scope.  Thus the desire.    It comes up now and then, but not that often.   Total solars (I have seen 6) would be another, though for those I have been known to rent gear.

 

Too bad about the Exos Nano.   At $140 and a claimed ability to support 15lbs, it might have been a reasonable answer.     The AZ-GTi is only claimed to do 11lb, but I read with a counterweight it can do more which could make it fit my bill, but I also read it might have too much vibration.    My heaviest OTA is the 120mm EPO and it usually will sit on the CG-5 unless I really need the extra resolution or light gathering on the 8"  SCT.

 

I have some smaller scopes, and that's what I use, but once you go large aperture it's hard to go back.

Edited by Brad Templeton, 06 February 2023 - 03:26 PM.

[hcf]

Thanks.  Some interesting options here.    I should note that a couple people thought I was trying to go for a two-telescope mount.  I am not.       I mean it's an interesting option, but not something to pay more for.  The main mount will carry the main scope and do photography, the 2nd mount would carry another telescope and be visual only.

The two telescope mounts can be used with one telescope and a counterweight attached in place of the other scope.  First Light Optics in the UK sells the SkyTee2 mount only without the tripod for about $365 shipped in case you have a good tripod. It is manual though.

 

https://www.cloudyni...nt-review-r3309

[Brad Templeton]

Why don't I see the SkyTee 2 on this side of the pond?     It looks reasonable.   Though sadly, the tripods I have are photographic and may not be up to this.

 

Some day somebody will sell "The ultimate mount" and I will up my main mount to that.  

 

That's a mount which has:

 

1. A very simple and solid Alt-Az design to let it be sturdy but not large
2. Motors and encoders on both Alt and Az, but very few smarts in the mount itself (just ether/wifi/USB-C).   The encoders let you manually move the telescope without losing alignment
3. Everything else done by your old cell phone (or current if you want) with a mount that sticks an eyepiece on the camera of the phone so you insert it into the main tube or into a guidescope.  You turn it on, it detects everything roughly from the cell phone, and it hunts around for stars and does all alignment and calibration without you touching anything.   If in a hurry you can manually give it the first star.   Or if your cell phone camera is a good one -- I tend to buy high end phones -- it can plate solve to do this fast.   Why buy a $600 Starsense or $150 Synscan HC when I have a $800 cell phone with better hardware in it already, just no easy way to attach it?
4. Re-aligns quickly if you kick the tripod leg -- we've all done it.
5. Low cost rotor for the camera for those doing long-exposure work
6. Powered by USB-C ( perhaps at 12v but if it can run at 5v3a a whole raft of cheap batteries become available. )   With USB-C hub for power and data to other devices
7. Way to detect or tell it orientation of my diagonal so it can make the slow motion controls always be "press up to go up"
8. Under $1K

I think that price can be attained, in fact, well under it, for pretty heavy scopes.   The eyepiece that mounts to the cell phone holder does not have to be visual quality, its just to find bright stars.

Edited by Brad Templeton, 07 February 2023 - 05:51 PM.