119 replies to this topic

[Wow!]

This looks like an amazing scope... might even sell the Esprit for it. Smaller and lighter is so much better when you have to travel to shoot.

[Oldfracguy]

I was reading the thread about the Askar 140 APO, and decided to try the 120 because that's the largest scope I can manage on the mount I have, a Stellarvue M002C on a column.  I posted in that 140 forum, and it was suggested I post in this one dedicated the the 120.  I only do visual observation--no imaging--so some of my observations may or may not be relevant:

 

https://www.cloudyni...0#entry13207777

 

https://www.cloudyni...0#entry13208226

 

https://www.cloudyni...0#entry13208481

[Brollen]

Thanks Oldfracguy for consolidating your findings/experience in this relevant thread.

 

Like you I also have a SV M002C mount on the SV pier attached to a heavy-duty Innorel carbon fiber tripod. I have a NoH CT-20 mount, which can be counter-balanced and it has a higher payload, but right now my M002C setup works really well for quick setups.

 

So I’m especially interested to hear of your experiences not only with this scope - I’m very interested in it! - but also how it plays with the SV M002C.

 

Clear skies!

Edited by Brollen, 20 January 2024 - 09:57 AM.

[Oldfracguy]

Another CN buddy asked me about my impressions of this new Askar 120 APO, and here's what I just wrote to him this morning:

 

-----------------------------------------------

So far, it has performed better than I expected with respect to not showing any residual CA around bright targets.  Jupiter was the sharpest I have ever seen it.  The edge of the planet was as if someone put a razor blade on the tip of a compass and traced a circle out of the black background sky.  I just sold a used Celestron C6 a couple weeks ago.  Even though I could see a few more stars in clusters like M36 and M37 in Auriga with the C6 (and the two C8s I had last year), they don't have the crispness and sharpness of a good ED or SD refractor--not even close.  Jupiter's features, and especially the edge of the edge of the planet, were definitely not as sharp in the C6 as they were in the Askar 120 APO.

 

Here's an example:  when I try to find M36, I first find the edge star in Auriga that is on the "bottom" of the constellation as you look at it about 8 PM now.  The bright star Capella is in the upper left, so that is the orientation I'm describing here.  The star is Theta Aurigae, the one just above and to the right of the word "AURIGA" in this picture:

 

 

Theta Aurigae is an unequal double star.  The brighter component is 3rd Magnitude, and its smaller companion is 7th magnitude.  They are separated by 3.5 arcseconds.  If you can split those two stars, then you are in for a night of "good seeing", as they say.  Your Evostar 72 should be able to split that double when the seeing is good.  Well, I could not for the life of me split it cleanly with the C6.  The two stars were muddled blobs.  The same thing was noted on Alnitak, the star on the left side of Orion's belt.  What got me was that my 53-year-old Mayflower 60mm f/11.7 achromat, using a KK Fujiyama HD-OR 7mm Orthoscopic Eyepiece, was able to show that faint component of Theta Aurigae intermittently, while in the C6 the two stars were fuzzy cotton balls.  I got the idea that the smaller companion star was on the top, that it, to the West, of the brighter star.  Last night I checked with this Askar 120 APO using a 5mm Fujiyama Orthoscopic, and there it was, plain as day, right where my little Mayflower indicated it might be.

There's a dude here on CN called "Eddgie".  He knows a lot about star-testing and all that optical stuff.  After I bought an AT130EDT last year and was totally disappointed in how it showed so much excessive CA around bright targets--more even than a regular ATxxED scope like you old Orion 4" f/7 ED scope--Eddgie coughed up the funds and bought the FPL-53 version of the AT130EDT sold by Teleskop Service in Germany, the TS-Optics Photo Line 130mm f/7.  After he got that TS-Optics 130mm f/7 FPL_53 Triplet, he was totally impressed.  That is awesome, since he's owned dozens of refractors and some big SCTs as well.  The Astro-Tech EDT triplets use regular FK-61 or FCD-1 glass as their center element.  I was never unsatisfied with the level of CA I saw with any of the four AT115EDTs I've had.  In fact, I really could not see very much at all.  On the other hand, with this Askar 120 APO, which we have to also assume uses some unspecified "regular ED" glass for its center element, the level of CA rejection is a little better than the AT115EDT, and the sharpness of the views of Jupiter, and especially the lunar surface, is noticeably better.   So, based on my experience so far, this Askar 120 APO shows that, in the 120mm aperture size at least, using a "regular ED" central element will do the job as long as the glass is properly figured, and the objective lens assembled properly and collimated.

One prominent maker of telescopes and eyepieces with green labeling defines as APO as any scope that will show no residual color around Sirius at 200x when in focus.  I stuck a 4mm eyepiece in this Askar 120 APO for 210x and saw no color at all around Sirius.  When defocusing a little both inward and outward, I could just see a hint of color, but that's it--none at all when in focus.

------------------------------------------------------

Edited by Oldfracguy, 20 January 2024 - 06:22 PM.

[Oldfracguy]

The Askar 120 APO works fine on my Stellarvue M002C with the 11.25" column on a CG-4 tripod.  I did have to order the MEC101 column base adaptor because the bolt that attaches the mount head to the tripod on a CG-4 has M10 metric threads.  I also added a 2-ft long piece of 1/2" copper pipe on the saddle to serve as a handle.  It attaches using two 1/4"-20 bolts:

 

 

Here it is with an SvBONY SV503 102mm f/7 ED Doublet (AT102ED clone) aboard.  You can see the copper pipe handle sticking out:

 

 

I did end up having to cut off a few inches of that copper pipe so it would just clear the top of the tripod with the scope pointed straight up.

Edited by Oldfracguy, 20 January 2024 - 06:28 PM.

[Oldfracguy]

One trick I did to the M002C that another CN member recommended was to rub some soap on the surfaces of those two large thin white Teflon washer bearings and on surfaces they contact.  I used a chunk of regular Ivory bath soap.  Here is where to apply it:

 

 

 

 

 

After the soap is applied you can tighten down those large silver Altitude and Azimuth tension knobs a lot harder and still have good control of the scope's position.  Lately, though, there is a little more difficulty getting the position to move at first, as if it's sticking again.  I'll probably have to apply another coat of that Ivory soap to the surfaces again.

 

 

[BWAZ]

Can any owner of 120APO check if the scope works at the full aperture? As mentioned earlier, the tube is shared with the 103 model, being only 110mm OD,  and therefore I'm a bit concerned whether there is any aperture reduction.

 

Best

[Oldfracguy]

In case anyone reading this thread is considering a new Askar 120 APO and would like to know how much it weighs when outfitted for visual operation, I just weighed mine with an Orion 9x50 RACI, a 2" Baader BBHS Silver Sitall Mirror Diagonal, and a 1.25" APM 18mm UFF eyepiece installed.  It totalled 17.4 lbs, or 7.9 kg.

Edited by Oldfracguy, 24 January 2024 - 10:51 PM.

[Brollen]

In case anyone reading this thread is considering a new Askar 120 APO and would like to know how much it weighs when outfitted for visual operation, I jjust weighed mine with an Orion 9x50 RACI, a 2" Baader BBHS Silver Sitall Mirror Diagonal, and a 1.25" APM 18mm UFF eyepiece installed.  It totalled 17.4 lbs, or 7.9 kg.

Thanks for that update. Sounds about right - somewhere between a fully kitted 115mm triplet and a similarly kitted 130mm triplet.

 

When I had my AT115EDT and I weighed it after similarly outfitting it, I think it was in the 15 pound range. My triplet APO Sharpstar 140PH was closer to 26 pounds similarly outfitted.

[Oldfracguy]

Thanks for that update. Sounds about right - somewhere between a fully kitted 115mm triplet and a similarly kitted 130mm triplet.

 

When I had my AT115EDT and I weighed it after similarly outfitting it, I think it was in the 15 pound range. My triplet APO Sharpstar 140PH was closer to 26 pounds similarly outfitted.

I've had a few AT115EDTs myself.  The last one with the same finder, 2" mirror diagonal and eyepiece weighed 16.0 lbs.  I had an AT130EDT that came in at 23 lbs. with the same accessories, so it looks like this Askar 120 APO is right in the "Main Sequence" of triplet refractors  .

 

EDIT:  I forgot to mention that I was always able to reach focus with any type of diagonal with the AT115EDT without having to insert an extension tube of any kind.  One afternoon I was suprised that, using a 2" mirror diagonal that eats up the most light path of any of my diagonals, I was able to rack the focuser out far enough to achieve focus on a target no more than 10 yards away, and even snap a photo using a cheap digital camera held up to the eyepiece:

 

 

That's pretty much the extent of my "imaging"  .

Edited by Oldfracguy, 25 January 2024 - 10:40 AM.

[topomountain]

im still prowling this thread looking for comparisons to the at115edt and at125edl and how large is the gap?

[Oldfracguy]

im still prowling this thread looking for comparisons to the at115edt and at125edl and how large is the gap?

 

The size of the gap depends on what you want to look at.  If you want wider field at lower magnifications, the AT125EDL will show a little more detail only owing to its larger aperture.  Stars in both scopes will be pinpoints.  Of course, the AT115EDT will have a 21% wider field that the AT125EDL with any given eyepiece pretty much.

 

The AT125EDL does not quit when you put in the equivalent of a 3mm eyepiece (say, a KK Fujiyama 9mm Orthoscopic in an ES 3x Focal Entender).  That's 325x.  If the seeing is excellent, substitute the 9mm with a 6mm Orthoscopic for 488x and hold on.

 

On bright targets, the AT125EDL shows no color at even over 500x.  The AT115EDT will start to show some at over 300x.

 

The tube rings on the AT125EDL are too loose out of the box.  People have added an extra layer of thin felt to the inside of the rings to fix that problem.

 

The AT125EDL is significantly longer than the AT115EDT, and depending on the mount you have, you may need a pier extension column to get the AT125EDL high enough off the ground for comfortable viewing.

[topomountain]

sorry for the lack of clarity in my question, 

im clear on the focal length and fov, im looking for mid to high powers planetary and lunar and comparing these with the askar 120

 

and does the askar 120 beat out the at125edl you think?  you seem to really like it so far

[Oldfracguy]

sorry for the lack of clarity in my question, 

im clear on the focal length and fov, im looking for mid to high powers planetary and lunar and comparing these with the askar 120

 

and does the askar 120 beat out the at125edl you think?  you seem to really like it so far

No, it does not beat out the AT125EDL on medium to high powers for lunar and planetary.  It's not far behind, though. 

[topomountain]

No, it does not beat out the AT125EDL on medium to high powers for lunar and planetary.  It's not far behind, though. 

So are you a fan of the sekar 120 as its close in performance and smaller and easier to mount? Or what pre tell

[Oldfracguy]

So are you a fan of the sekar 120 as its close in performance and smaller and easier to mount? Or what pre tell

Yes, the Askar 120 APO is easier to manage than the AT125EDL simply because of its shorter length.  In fact, the other night I tried it on my CG-4 converted to Alt-Az without any height extending column, and I was able to sit on the lowest rung of this Berlebach adjustable observing chair and see Jupiter at its highest as it crossed the meridian due South of me:

 

 

[CHASLX200]

The size of the gap depends on what you want to look at.  If you want wider field at lower magnifications, the AT125EDL will show a little more detail only owing to its larger aperture.  Stars in both scopes will be pinpoints.  Of course, the AT115EDT will have a 21% wider field that the AT125EDL with any given eyepiece pretty much.

 

The AT125EDL does not quit when you put in the equivalent of a 3mm eyepiece (say, a KK Fujiyama 9mm Orthoscopic in an ES 3x Focal Entender).  That's 325x.  If the seeing is excellent, substitute the 9mm with a 6mm Orthoscopic for 488x and hold on.

 

On bright targets, the AT125EDL shows no color at even over 500x.  The AT115EDT will start to show some at over 300x.

 

The tube rings on the AT125EDL are too loose out of the box.  People have added an extra layer of thin felt to the inside of the rings to fix that problem.

 

The AT125EDL is significantly longer than the AT115EDT, and depending on the mount you have, you may need a pier extension column to get the AT125EDL high enough off the ground for comfortable viewing.

My 125EDL can do a 2.5mm and Barlow easy on some objects. 

[Oldfracguy]

It doesn't get much simpler than this:

 

 

The Askar 120 APO on a CG-4 converted to Alt-Az mode and an adjustable height observing chair.  The mount handles the 17.4 lb. OTA with no problem, and it stays where it was when you change eyepieces; so much simpler than the M002C for this size and weight scope.  I actually do think the M002C could manage the 140 APO, but so far this 120 is doing quite well for itself.

 

 

 

 

[CHASLX200]

It doesn't get much simpler than this:

 

101_2746.JPG

 

The Askar 120 APO on a CG-4 converted to Alt-Az mode and an adjustable height observing chair.  The mount handles the 17.4 lb. OTA with no problem, and it stays where it was when you change eyepieces; so much simpler than the M002C for this size and weight scope.  I actually do think the M002C could manage the 140 APO, but so far this 120 is doing quite well for itself.

My GP would jitter all over. That tripod you got is much better than my wood one.

[Endymion]

How well will the focuser handle an ASI6200, 7 position 2" filter wheel, ZWO large OAG with guide camera?   Any flopping or tilting as the scope moves?

[akdwivedi]

interesting thread.. would love to know how the askar 120 apo performs against the well know skywatcher 120ED doublet. 

[Oldfracguy]

interesting thread.. would love to know how the askar 120 apo performs against the well know skywatcher 120ED doublet. 

 

Your wish has come through...

 

https://www.cloudyni...evostar-120-ed/

Edited by Oldfracguy, 05 February 2024 - 12:10 PM.

[Astrodave]

Can any owner of 120APO check if the scope works at the full aperture? As mentioned earlier, the tube is shared with the 103 model, being only 110mm OD,  and therefore I'm a bit concerned whether there is any aperture reduction.

 

Best

This is a really good question and one I would like to know too since I am trying to decide between a 125edl and the askar 120. Another concern I have is from what I can tell the 125edl is about 2” longer than the askar but there isn’t much data on astronomics website about the length of the 125edl with and without dew shield extended. I am using a macrostar deluxe mount and am concerned that the tube will hit the tripod at zenith. 

Edited by Astrodave, 13 February 2024 - 10:08 PM.

[Haggish59]

Hi, I am following the discussions regarding the new reasonably priced Askar Apo series with great interest. I chose a SW Esprit over the Askar 103 apo, but now that the 120 apo has arrived I am curious as to whether the 20mm and slightly longer focal length will be better for me. I use an asi6200mc camera on my Esprit100ed and an AM5 mount today. Sees the weight is about the same, but will it be as sharp? Is there anyone who has compared these that can be of help in my decision? I have plans to bring this setup to an Astrofarm in Namibia next summer ;-)

[Oldfracguy]

This is a really good question and one I would like to know too since I am trying to decide between a 125edl and the askar 120. Another concern I have is from what I can tell the 125edl is about 2” longer than the askar but there isn’t much data on astronomics website about the length of the 125edl with and without dew shield extended. I am using a macrostar deluxe mount and am concerned that the tube will hit the tripod at zenith. 

OK, I may have some info that might help, although I just do visual observation and no imaging:

 

The Askar 120 APO shown in this Orion Padded Carry Bag has its focuser racked out to where an eyepiece is in focus:

 

 

The scope has a Baader T2 Zeiss-spec Prism Diagonal with a 2" 35mm Extension Tube, and the the focuser is racked out to about 60mm on its scale.  From the front of the extended dew shield to the eyepiece, it measures 36 inches.

 

Now, compare that to an AT125EDL:

 

 

If you want an AT125EDL, you will definitely need a mount with a pier extension column.  Here's how I mount the Askar 120APO now, and how I would have mounted my old AT125EDL if I had only had this 16" pier extension back then:

 

Edited by Oldfracguy, 15 February 2024 - 12:09 PM.