154 replies to this topic

[Taylor]

artik, what are your thoughts on using OpenLiveStacker to create a sort of open source version of the Pegasus Astro SmartEye? 

SoHo Enterprise has an IMX585 sensor for the RPi: https://soho-enterpr...rt-sample-sale/

 

It works with Pi Zero 2W: https://soho-enterpr...or-rpi-zero-2w/

Not sure if Zero 2W has enough power for live stacking? 

 

If not, there is a CM4 expansion board, which should keep the physical size of the “eyepiece” sort of small:  https://github.com/harlab/CM4Ext_Nano

CM4 offers 8gb RAM and faster eMMC. 

 

There is a high resolution 2.1 inch 480x480 MIPI touchscreen that can be the digital eyepiece: https://www.buydispl...h-circle-screen

 

I suppose the end result would be an eyepiece with the dimensions slightly larger than that of a large eyepiece like the largest Panoptics or Naglers. 

I still can’t figure out how Pegasus Astro managed to fit the electronics into their small eyepiece that can perform live stacking, they must have designed a custom CPU board. 

[artik]

artik, what are your thoughts on using OpenLiveStacker to create a sort of open source version of the Pegasus Astro SmartEye? 

 

 

I agree that it is quite possible, but it requires several things:

 

Need a small package that contains - battary, pi, camera, wifi , some cooling, small display with high DPI and an good optics to show the display as if it is an eyepiece. It is design on its own, quite complex and I'm almost certainly pricey.

 

The only advantage I can see over OpenLiveStacker is to see it via "eyepiece" but not sure how big the advantage is.

 

I'm actually working in a mode that allows the stacking to be much more dynamic so you can just use it on manual alt-az mount: https://www.youtube....h?v=K62P6d2nKo4 it is currently simulation based on recorded data but gives a general idea (some more logic need to be added to handle it)

 

Anyway it seems to me that using tablet instead of eyepiece can actually be way more convenient 

[artik]

Android 14 users

 

DO NOT UPGRADE to version 30! Continue to use 29.

 

Alternatively you can install 29 from github: https://github.com/a...releases/beta29

 

I'm working on fix.

 

I updated OpenLiveStacker on google play to version 31 - I downgraded SDK to older version now it does not crash on Android 14.

 

So Android 14 users please update to latest version.

 

I still need to figure out what Google had "improved"  in their API so it all stopped working. (But I already have some directions)

[drcbweaver]

Is there any way to keep the screen on while OLS is working? The maximum screen timeout setting in Android is 30 minutes so it would be nice if OLS would have an option to keep the screen on.

[artik]

Is there any way to keep the screen on while OLS is working? The maximum screen timeout setting in Android is 30 minutes so it would be nice if OLS would have an option to keep the screen on.

Good idea but I need to learn how to do it.

 

In general it isn't a problem since up will still be running even when the screen is black.

[drcbweaver]

Good idea but I need to learn how to do it.

 

In general it isn't a problem since up will still be running even when the screen is black.

Ok, thanks for that info.

 

A few more questions if you don't mind...

 

I took some pics of M13 through my Hestia attached to my Star Adventurer Mini. I did various tests with:

 

1. The Gravity app (Vaonis companion app to the Hestia)
2. The native Pixel 8 Camera app in Astrophotography mode
3. Deep Sky Camera (in Raw)
4. Open Live Stacker (using the phones camera)

I did this kind of as a comparison test since it was my first opportunity to put OLS to the test since first hearing about it.

 

The image it produced was kinda of fuzzy compared to the stack produced with the images from Deep Sky Camera and the native Pixel Camera app.

 

So, the question, does this do alignment during stacking or is it relying on perfect tracking? 

 

My theory, when looking at the picture, was that slightly imperfect tracking was resulting in a fuzzy stack due to them not being aligned correctly, but maybe that's way off base...

 

Since this was my first time using OLS since finding out about it, maybe I was missing some other setting?

 

Perhaps "derotate" should be checked?

 

Keep up the good work!

Edited by drcbweaver, 29 July 2024 - 10:00 AM.

[artik]

1st I suggest show images so I can see what is going on.

 

Ols aligns the images but there may be many things gor example touching screen

 

Regarding derotate it us for alt az tracking mount only.

 

So show image and content of txt file it comes with

[drcbweaver]

1st I suggest show images so I can see what is going on.

 

Ols aligns the images but there may be many things gor example touching screen

 

Regarding derotate it us for alt az tracking mount only.

 

So show image and content of txt file it comes with

Ok, then my theory wasn't correct.

 

Unfortunately I can't find the photos. I cleared the app data and I believe that deleted them. If I notice it in the future I will report back and attach the photos.

[artik]

Ok, then my theory wasn't correct.

 

Unfortunately I can't find the photos. I cleared the app data and I believe that deleted them. If I notice it in the future I will report back and attach the photos.

There are many setting that affect quality: exposure time, iso, image format (do you have raw) and of course the final stretch you do.

 

Another thing: if you have visible eyepiece circle in the frame, the registration may fail because it would look at the circle - (it is global image alignment - not star based alignment) so use smaller ROI.

[drcbweaver]

Another thing: if you have visible eyepiece circle in the frame, the registration may fail because it would look at the circle - (it is global image alignment - not star based alignment) so use smaller ROI.

 

That is probably the reason. The pics I took with the other apps all have the eyepiece circle visible so OLS most likely did as well.

[artik]

That is probably the reason. The pics I took with the other apps all have the eyepiece circle visible so OLS most likely did as well.

Yes it would likely fail - use ROI to get rid of the circle.

 

Maybe I need an option to reduce registration region of interest to prevent such issues for ones who aren't aware.

 

 

Anyway here are tips for Android camera: https://github.com/a...internal-camera

[jcharron]

artik, what are your thoughts on using OpenLiveStacker to create a sort of open source version of the Pegasus Astro SmartEye? 

SoHo Enterprise has an IMX585 sensor for the RPi: https://soho-enterpr...rt-sample-sale/

 

It works with Pi Zero 2W: https://soho-enterpr...or-rpi-zero-2w/

Not sure if Zero 2W has enough power for live stacking? 

 

If not, there is a CM4 expansion board, which should keep the physical size of the “eyepiece” sort of small:  https://github.com/harlab/CM4Ext_Nano

CM4 offers 8gb RAM and faster eMMC. 

 

There is a high resolution 2.1 inch 480x480 MIPI touchscreen that can be the digital eyepiece: https://www.buydispl...h-circle-screen

 

I suppose the end result would be an eyepiece with the dimensions slightly larger than that of a large eyepiece like the largest Panoptics or Naglers. 

I still can’t figure out how Pegasus Astro managed to fit the electronics into their small eyepiece that can perform live stacking, they must have designed a custom CPU board. 

Hi Taylor,

 

I think there is a kind of free project to do something similar here : https://www.cloudyni...994&hl=+astrowl

 

I don't know if it is what you are looking for ?

Edited by jcharron, 04 September 2024 - 09:55 AM.

[UB_Astro]

Hi Artik,

 

I finally want to take up the task of building OLS in Linux.  I followed the instruction in github to install the libraries and ccpcms.  Things seems to be OK till this point.

 

The next step is to build OLS from your github clone.  I really have no experience and hence want to be sure.  The critical step as I see is in the cmake step. I will be using watch folder with dng files input from my Raspberry Pi camera.  Also my chromebook does not support SSE4.  I understand that I need to add the path of libraw into cmake to enable dng support.  I find the path to libraw.so in /usr/lib.x86_64-linux-gnu/

 

So should my cmake command be

cmake -DNO_SSE4=OFF -DCMAKE_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/lib.x86_64-linux-gnu/ ..

 

Thanks in advance for your support.

[drcbweaver]

How do I get plate solving to work? It fails to find a solution 100% of the time. I am using a Google Pixel 8 and trying to plate solve through a Hestia. I have downloaded all of the available ASTAP databases.

 

Thanks for any help in getting this to work. 

[artik]

Hi Artik,

 

 

So should my cmake command be

cmake -DNO_SSE4=OFF -DCMAKE_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/lib.x86_64-linux-gnu/ ..

 

Thanks in advance for your support.

Generally speaking if you installed libraw from standard repositories it should find it automatically - watch for cmake messages related to libraw. If it is in custom location use -DCMAKE_INCLUDE_PATH=/path/to/header/directory -DCMAKE_LIBRARY_PATH=/path/to/lib/directory - note you need both header and library location

 

And yes -DNO_SSE4=OFF is correct flag

[artik]

How do I get plate solving to work? It fails to find a solution 100% of the time. I am using a Google Pixel 8 and trying to plate solve through a Hestia. I have downloaded all of the available ASTAP databases.

 

Thanks for any help in getting this to work. 

 

Generally speaking ASTAP requires lots of stars in FOV and good quality image. I mean really good quality - I even suggest try to stack several seconds of data and than plate solve.

Another important thing is focal/length or field of view. Calculate correct  field of view of the camera and put it into FOV location. Be careful regarding FOV orientation - it asks for vertical FOV in terms of IMAGE. It is critical for solving. You can try capture an image and put it to online solver like https://nova.astrometry.net/upload to see what image FOV (assuming it would solve correctly)

 

For finding objects with Hestia I'd also suggest to try AstroHopper. Use split screen feature of android put AstroHopper in one half and OLS in another.

[artik]

I will be using watch folder with dng files input from my Raspberry Pi camera.  Also my chromebook does not support SSE4

 

Are you going to run OpenLiveStacker on Pi (Arm) or on Chromebook (x86/x86_64)?

 

If it is on ARM than SSE flag is irrelevant because SSE in not ARM instruction set

Edited by artik, 05 September 2024 - 04:04 AM.

[UB_Astro]

Are you going to run OpenLiveStacker on Pi (Arm) or on Chromebook (x86/x86_64)?

 

If it is on ARM than SSE flag is irrelevant because SSE in not ARM instruction set

Well, it was a chromebook.  And I followed some online instruction to alter the BIOS and install a full light weight linux OS on it.  The CPU is a intel N2840.

 

I will try to do the build work later these 2 days and I hope thing will run smooth.  More questions - I do run very short of disk space as this chromebook only has 16G space.  I have about 1.1G left now.  After building OLS, can I delete the ccpcms directory completely and the OLS directory with the exception of the files in the build folder?

 

Also, if I make my own flat file, what should be the file format? Can tiff work?

[artik]

Well, it was a chromebook.  And I followed some online instruction to alter the BIOS and install a full light weight linux OS on it.  The CPU is a intel N2840.

 

I will try to do the build work later these 2 days and I hope thing will run smooth.  More questions - I do run very short of disk space as this chromebook only has 16G space.  I have about 1.1G left now.  After building OLS, can I delete the ccpcms directory completely and the OLS directory with the exception of the files in the build folder?

 

Also, if I make my own flat file, what should be the file format? Can tiff work?

After you install cppcms yes you can delete the source files. also you can disable static libraries by adding -DDISABLE_STATIC=ON for cppcms also running strip on resulting shared objects can help same for OLS.

 

What do you mean by flat file?

2nd what camera do you connect?

[UB_Astro]

After you install cppcms yes you can delete the source files. also you can disable static libraries by adding -DDISABLE_STATIC=ON for cppcms also running strip on resulting shared objects can help same for OLS.

 

What do you mean by flat file?

2nd what camera do you connect?

By flat file I mean the calibration Flat.

 

I am using a Raspberry Pi camera connected to a Raspberry Pi.  This is solely an image capturing module.  The dng files captured in the Pi will be dumped one by one via WiFi to the chromebook watch folder and the Live Stacking software installed on the chromebook will do the live stacking.  So in effect I am running 2 computing devices in parallel.

 

I am not sure if I understand your advices on deleting the source files.  My understanding is this:  Once I build the OLS and check that it is working, I would like to delete the ccpcms directory completely.  Then for the OLS part, under the Openlivestack directory, I delete all the content except the build folder as I believe the build folder contains all the files created during the build process, while the rest are source files from cloning your github repository.  My biggest worry is that in running OLS, it still needs to have access to the files from the cloned sources.

[drcbweaver]

Generally speaking ASTAP requires lots of stars in FOV and good quality image. I mean really good quality - I even suggest try to stack several seconds of data and than plate solve.

Another important thing is focal/length or field of view. Calculate correct  field of view of the camera and put it into FOV location. Be careful regarding FOV orientation - it asks for vertical FOV in terms of IMAGE. It is critical for solving. You can try capture an image and put it to online solver like https://nova.astrometry.net/upload to see what image FOV (assuming it would solve correctly)

 

For finding objects with Hestia I'd also suggest to try AstroHopper. Use split screen feature of android put AstroHopper in one half and OLS in another.

Ok, thanks for the tips. I suspect it is due to incorrect FOV. I had uploaded some images to the site you suggest and it successfully solved them, but I had not thought of using it to get the correct FOV.

 

If it still doesn't work, I will try AstroHopper. I had used a similar app called SkyEye with mixed success which is why I would like to get plate solving to work.

[artik]

If it still doesn't work, I will try AstroHopper. I had used a similar app called SkyEye with mixed success which is why I would like to get plate solving to work.

What is typical FOV of this Hestia?

 

Generally with FOV of 1 degree and above AstroHopper is more than sufficient (I use it with Celestron C8 with 2000mm FL)

 

Regarding plate solving and ASTAP I found that ASTAP generally requires better quality than astrometry.net - but it works locally on Android and very fast.

Edited by artik, 05 September 2024 - 05:39 AM.

[UB_Astro]

I just finish the OLS build, during cmake, I note that libraw is included.

 

After the installation, I cd to the OpenLiveStacker directory and run ./build/ols_cmd config.js,  it says Failed to open config file:config.js

 

Then I cd back to the build directory and run ./ols_cmd config.js.  It again says Failed to open config file:config.js

 

I note that there is a file named config.js under the OpenLiveStacker directory, but no such file under the build folder.  Is this as expected?

 

Can I simply open that config.js file in OpenLiveStacker with a text editor and edit the content?  But still I am not sure if I can turn on the service.

[UB_Astro]

Ok, thanks for the tips. I suspect it is due to incorrect FOV. I had uploaded some images to the site you suggest and it successfully solved them, but I had not thought of using it to get the correct FOV.

 

If it still doesn't work, I will try AstroHopper. I had used a similar app called SkyEye with mixed success which is why I would like to get plate solving to work.

I also have some plate solving problem with astap to start with, but when I bin down to 2x2 things improved.  But as said image quality is very influential to the success.  In command line mode I am not sure if you can fall back to using triples but not quads when quality is low.  Using triples improve success rate a lot.

[artik]

Generally Linux instructions are here: https://github.com/a...OpenLiveStacker

 

You run it from source directory, you edit config.json as you wish. Note I forgot you do need the www-data directory as it contains all UI html/image/javascript

 

Files go to data directory