7797 replies to this topic

[jarrodeu]

I have a really nice Deltarem 8x40 that has a very stiff, virtually frozen focuser. I was able to lift one eyepiece off but the other appears to be held down by a tiny grub screw, that I cannot remove after trying WD40 and now penetrating oil. What else can I do. I tried posting a photo from IMGUR but all I got was a message to say I'd been blocked by Cloudy nights!

Heat may help, but you don't want to get it too hot that close to the oculars or they may separate. That is a desirable binocular, probably the widest 8x ever made. Might be worth sending it to Suddarth.

 

Jarrod

[ChrisNYPilor]

I have a really nice Deltarem 8x40 that has a very stiff, virtually frozen focuser. I was able to lift one eyepiece off but the other appears to be held down by a tiny grub screw, that I cannot remove after trying WD40 and now penetrating oil. What else can I do. I tried posting a photo from IMGUR but all I got was a message to say I'd been blocked by Cloudy nights!

Maybe try heating the allen key so the heat goes mostly to the grub screw, and would likely dissipate quickly thereafter.  Heat might make the allen key fit tighter as well.

[brentwood]

Thanks for the comments. I thought about applying heat but was concerned about the heat on the eyepiece glue? Maybe I can put a barrier up/ I was wondering though would the heat also expand the screw , which has a flat screw head.  I was thinking about Cory , but am a bit concerned about that border these days!   

[brentwood]

Ah, I misread .it! The screw head is REALLY tiny and I doubt it would carry much heat. I have to use the smallest  screwdriver I have, about a mm across or less!  . The handle is too thin to get  a good grip on it and I have to use some pliers to get a better grip, which is kind of cumbersome !  

[semlin]

one suggestion is to use a loupe while seating the screwdriver on the grub screw to make sure you have good fitment.  one of my issues with zeiss is that the flathead screws require very thin blades to seat.

[ChrisNYPilor]

one suggestion is to use a loupe while seating the screwdriver on the grub screw to make sure you have good fitment.  one of my issues with zeiss is that the flathead screws require very thin blades to seat.

Would JIS screwdrivers fit better?  I bought these from Amazon, and found them quite useful.

 

https://www.amazon.c...J?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

https://www.amazon.c...,92&sr=1-9&th=1

Edited by ChrisNYPilor, 07 February 2025 - 12:34 AM.

[Ancient Mariner]

One more note regarding Otsuka:

They are one of the remaining older "classic era" binocular manufacturers still alive and kicking in Japan.

https://otsukaopt.co.jp/en/

 

Not long ago (2019), Otsuka acquired Katsuma and continues to produce "Glory" binoculars (as well as their decades-old "Dia Stone" house brand).

Good to hear that Otsuka are still in production. I remember they made some good wide angle binoculars for Chinon and Sears. My multi-coated Tokina 7x35 porros were made by Otsuka and they are of superb optical quality. It's also good news that they will continue the production of the Katsuma mil spec porros. As with all the surviving Japanese optical companies Otsuka will also make some lower quality OEM products to keep the company productive.

[Eric Drum]

Thanks for the comments. I thought about applying heat but was concerned about the heat on the eyepiece glue? Maybe I can put a barrier up/ I was wondering though would the heat also expand the screw , which has a flat screw head.
...
Ah, I misread .it! The screw head is REALLY tiny and I doubt it would carry much heat. I have to use the smallest  screwdriver I have, about a mm across or less!  . The handle is too thin to get  a good grip on it and I have to use some pliers to get a better grip, which is kind of cumbersome !

Heat may still be a winner, if you consider a heat-cool cycle, and torque it while cooling. Or warm the whole body, and just cool the screw.

A clean electric soldering iron can be useful to heat the point it contacts. Protect the glass from rising hot air. Alu-foil? The screwdriver could provide the coolth. Before we saved the ozone layer with the Montreal Protocol, you used to be able to buy aerosol cans just containing propellant, for rapid point cooling to test faulty electronic components, through a long tubular nozzle. I guess they still exist? Use in ventilated area, with no naked flames or sparks ... Plumbers also have aerosol cans for locally freezing water pipes. You may even already have a dust-off jet can for lens cleaning.
 
Take it gently, use repetitions and steady increase of temperature differences, rather than 'going in hot' first time.
Tapping the handle end of a screwdriver gently, but with something hard, along the screw axis, can help break free.

WD40 or penetrating oils may need patience: overnight?
 
Even if you can't create a temperature differential, different metals expand more or less on heating.
I vaguely remember British binoculars used a mythical alloy called 'Elektra', but I can no longer find the recipe. Al/Mg? Am I hallucinating? Germany developed 120 (?) different alloys for Zeppelins, so binocular alloys may not be simple ...

Material	Coefficient of Linear Thermal Expansion (α) (10^-6 /°C)
Stainless Steel 10-11
Titanium	8.6
Bronze		17-18
Brass		18-19
Aluminum	23.1
Magnesium	25-26
Zinc		30-35

Ooh, pretty green/purple colors: I don't know how I did that.

Edit:

Ah, "Elektron" , Mg 90%, Al 9%, other 1%.

Elektron alloy might be in the range of 24-27 x 10^-6 /°C.

Refs: Kriegsmarine, Hensoldt, Zeiss

Of course, some Habicht arms also corrode nicely.

So 'British' may have been my hallucination? Or as per Wikipedia, a 1908 German invention, currently a British 1953 trademark.

Probably anything labelled 'Magnesium' is really 'Elektron'.

Reminds me of a metallurgist friend buying pedals in a bike shop. She was trying to persuade the salesman ("Do you want steel or alloy?") that steel was really also an alloy, not just aluminium-mixes.

Good news: the differential between screw and housing expansion when heated is very probably in our favour!

Edited by Eric Drum, 07 February 2025 - 06:16 AM.

[Pinewood]

It is interesting that my Wuest IF (MOP JB34) 6x30s have the deepest depth of focus of ANY bin I own, and sharp and bright. I think the 7x35 late 50's Kowa are a little sharper and a little brighter, BUT not the same depth of focus.  Where do the NKK 8x30's show up on depth of field, sharpness, color, etc?

Hello Chris,

 

No question that a 6x will have greater depth of focus than binoculars of higher magnification.  Magnification is the principal factor for depth of focus in binoculars.

 

Clear skies,

Arthur

[semlin]

Hello Chris,

 

No question that a 6x will have greater depth of focus than binoculars of higher magnification.  Magnification is the principal factor for depth of focus in binoculars.

 

Clear skies,

Arthur

arthur, i am curious about this statement that magnficiation is the principal factor.  i would agree that a 6x will have more depth of field than an 8x of identical design.   

but many of my later cf binoculars have shallow depth of field compared to ww2 military binos of identical magnification intended for if use which are pretty much set and forget.  would eyepiece design not play a part?

 

and a faster lens will also have shallower depth of field than a slower one.  that is a basic principle of slr photography.  longer focal length binoculars thus have an offsetting factor to magnification and aperture creeps into the discussion.  

[semlin]

so i did a check on the "lar" labelling on the objective beauty rings of my close to hand 58-70 classic black body swifts

 

the holiday mark 2 is quintar

saratoga is quartar

neptune mark 2 (tamron) is zylar

commodore mark 2 is zylar

 

i then checked on the internet and found an audubon marked "ultrar"

 

everything else so far is trilar including an earlier neptune.

 

i noticed some variation on whether the marking is on the inside of the beauty ring, or the outside.

 

i suspect ultrar refers to the deep blue "uv coatings" that were popular mid 60s.  zylar probably also relates to coatings rather than lens elements but i have not puzzled it out.

[Pinewood]

@semlin

 

I did write 'principal factor."

 

Clear skies,

Arthur

[semlin]

@semlin

 

I did write 'principal factor."

 

Clear skies,

Arthur

yes, that is what i was wondering about.  i am surprised to learn that.

 

i think depth of field is one of those topics that matters more in terrestrial observing than astronomy.  can't say that i have seen it discussed much.

[brentwood]

Would JIS screwdrivers fit better?  I bought these from Amazon, and found them quite useful.

 

 

Its a great idea to have something that could be put into a bigger handle, but those are way too big . Right now I have to push the screwdriver down with one hand twist it with a pair of pliers with the other hand ! Not easy! 

[brentwood]

The soldering iron is a good idea . I'll try that! Thanks! 

[Ancient Mariner]

so i did a check on the "lar" labelling on the objective beauty rings of my close to hand 58-70 classic black body swifts

 

the holiday mark 2 is quintar

saratoga is quartar

neptune mark 2 (tamron) is zylar

commodore mark 2 is zylar

 

i then checked on the internet and found an audubon marked "ultrar"

 

everything else so far is trilar including an earlier neptune.

 

i noticed some variation on whether the marking is on the inside of the beauty ring, or the outside.

 

i suspect ultrar refers to the deep blue "uv coatings" that were popular mid 60s.  zylar probably also relates to coatings rather than lens elements but i have not puzzled it out.

The ultrar designation seems to belong to the early Audubon made by Tamron, but the examples I have seen had no anti UV coating. When Hiyoshi took over the Audubon retained the same optical formula (with Erfle oculars) but the labelling was changed to quintar. The terms ultrar and zylar don't appear to be connected to any numerical system. It's all very confusing. Does anyone out there know?

[ChrisNYPilor]

Anyone ever hear of an H-12 6x30 Wuest.  I have an H-10 JB34 MOP 6x30.  I wonder why they changed the model number.  There are no markings at all on the front hinge.  This is a picture of the back.  I tried to search miniaturebinoculars list of trademark logos, but couldn't find a match for what looks like a GSZ logo, but I may be misinterpreting it. 

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[MisterDan]

I've seen that logo/mark once before.  I'm seeing "G" (shaped like an achromat) and "Z". I suppose it could be a rotated "N", but I'll stick with "Z" for now.  No real idea who GZ or ZG might signify.  The "G" possibilities are likely fewer than the "Z"s.  Glanz, Garasu (glass), or Anglicized "Glass". The "Z" may be Zaika, Zuiho, or some other name.  Who knows - it may be a Zuiho-Glanz collaboration.

 

This H-12 definitely appears to be older than the H-10s I've seen.  First guess:  Wuest changed the model number due to a different supplier.

 

It looks like a nice bino. Thanks for sharing. 

[ChrisNYPilor]

I've seen that logo/mark once before.  I'm seeing "G" (shaped like an achromat) and "Z". I suppose it could be a rotated "N", but I'll stick with "Z" for now.  No real idea who GZ or ZG might signify.  The "G" possibilities are likely fewer than the "Z"s.  Glanz, Garasu (glass), or Anglicized "Glass". The "Z" may be Zaika, Zuiho, or some other name.  Who knows - it may be a Zuiho-Glanz collaboration.

 

This H-12 definitely appears to be older than the H-10s I've seen.  First guess:  Wuest changed the model number due to a different supplier.

 

It looks like a nice bino. Thanks for sharing. a

If I look through some of the older postings I know the original ones (older) seem to have been made by Ofuna.  And then you have quite a few different makers thereafter.  I am guessing this was not made by Ofuna, and sometime between 1952 and 1958 - after MOIJ and before JB?

[semlin]

is it a "z" or two inverted "7" and "2" like kanji symbols?

 

zuiho is a z with two hash marks through it.

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Edited by semlin, 08 February 2025 - 07:21 PM.

[ChrisNYPilor]

The M-20 is also a 6x30, but that was 8 degree FOV.  The H-10 and the H-12 are both 6x30 7.5 degrees.  Seems odd to me that I can't find a single sold h-12 on a history search on ebay.  And nothing comes up in a google search.

[MisterDan]

The M-20 I "found" has an 8.3^o field and was made by Ofuna:

https://www.auctionn...ars-400686.html

I'm guessing that's the listing you saw.  Definitely post-MIOJ and pre-JL.

 

Yes, I'm sure Wuest worked with multiple makers/suppliers, including Ofuna (early on, as you noted), Hiyoshi (likely after Ofuna) and Musashi (likely their biggest/most-contracted supplier).

 

Most binoculars are often (very often) sold with no reference to brand.  Model numbers are even more rare in both listing titles and descriptions. Sellers don't want to restrict the "find-ability" of their listings by adding too many details. Another common scenario is the "borrowing" of listing info from another seller's ad for a like-branded binocular.  (I'm sure you noticed there were TWO listings for Wuest H-10 #169390, - and one of them was the H-12 in question.)

 

Unfortunately, the "best" searches sometimes end up being the most general, and we searchers are left to "weed" and filter through many more candidates.

 

Usually, it's a pain, but sometimes the extra time & tedium lead to some eye-bugging (and wholly unexpected) gems. 

 

Cheers.

Dan

[ChrisNYPilor]

In my search for IF 6x30's I found these on FB Marketplace.  The gentleman was asking me if I knew what they were and if they were worth anything.  I told him I had no idea, but I knew where to ask.  :-)  Another unmarked bin, but not even made in notations.  Could these be a USA manufacturer?

 

https://www.facebook...essenger_banner

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[ChrisNYPilor]

I figured they were just a USA maker that had a military contract and switched to civilian.  They looked pretty ho-hum to me, but then again my depth of knowledge is pretty limited.

[ChrisNYPilor]

The M-20 I "found" has an 8.3^o field and was made by Ofuna:

https://www.auctionn...ars-400686.html

I'm guessing that's the listing you saw.  Definitely post-MIOJ and pre-JL.

 

Yes, I'm sure Wuest worked with multiple makers/suppliers, including Ofuna (early on, as you noted), Hiyoshi (likely after Ofuna) and Musashi (likely their biggest/most-contracted supplier).

 

Most binoculars are often (very often) sold with no reference to brand.  Model numbers are even more rare in both listing titles and descriptions. Sellers don't want to restrict the "find-ability" of their listings by adding too many details. Another common scenario is the "borrowing" of listing info from another seller's ad for a like-branded binocular.  (I'm sure you noticed there were TWO listings for Wuest H-10 #169390, - and one of them was the H-12 in question.)

 

Unfortunately, the "best" searches sometimes end up being the most general, and we searchers are left to "weed" and filter through many more candidates.

 

Usually, it's a pain, but sometimes the extra time & tedium lead to some eye-bugging (and wholly unexpected) gems. 

 

Cheers.

Dan

The more looking I do, I find bins that are identical to Wuest also made my MOP.  So Ofuna created the Wuest Brand, Wuest used many manufacturers, AND Wuest also sold the rights to other brands to make their designs in the same factories they were using to make Wuest branded bins.