57 replies to this topic

[dweller25]

I like your plastic target, please tell me what is it called and where did you get it from ?

 

Edited by dweller25, 21 January 2024 - 04:49 AM.

[PawPaw]

Thanks everyone for the kind words.  It does make one feel good to accomplish a project that is fraught with the possibility of damage and end up with none.  Sometimes we all put off projects but I say go for it!  Winter time especially is a good timeframe for accomplishing projects. (indoors)  This one was worth sharing either way it ended up.  

 

There is another note I stumbled across just yesterday while reviewing some of Dave Trott's TS-80 videos.  In it he was explaining the translated version of a Takahashi advertisement in the 1971 Tenmon guide.  The ad was explaining their new triplet Semi-Apo design of the TS-80 and in the very first paragraph the following was noted by none other than Takahashi themselves:

 

"Nippon Kogaku has been manufacturing Semi-Apo lenses with two lenses, but how is it used?"  (Translated by Google).  So this is 1971 and Takahashi states their competitor Nikon has been making a Semi-Apo.  There have been several discussions on Galakuma's site discussing the Nikon 8cm that debuted in 1967.  One of the threads Galakuma states the following: 

 

"This object lens used Extra-low Dispersion lens. Nikon did not advertise so it.

We didn't know so,Nikon released it at a cheap price,only 89500yen.
I wanted to buy it, but I was not able to buy it because no money,at 1971.
Only one year later, it was raised to 168000yen.
I felled sorry very much and lost interest.
Now, As for the good thing of degree, it is priced about 150000-200000yen in japan."

 

These statements and the fact that even Takahashi believed it was a Semi=Apo design lends some weight to the argument.  Why did Nikon not advertise it as such?  They probably did not feel any need to and their market for amateur telescopes was a small part of their business model.  When the weather warms I look forward to more side by side testing between this lovely 1970 Nikon and its competition from Takahashi and Goto.

 

Cheers

 

Don

Edited by PawPaw, 21 January 2024 - 08:55 AM.

[Dave Trott]

We should remember that this was the 1970's and 80's. At that time the 80mm refractor was the flagship of the line. Companies like Goto and Takahashi had a huge investment in the design of their 80mm refractors and they took the competition seriously. I don't know why Nikon would neglect to promote an innovation like ED glass vigorously. But they seem to have been "above it all" in some sense. They also seem to have been rather non-responsive to the price competition offered by the other companies. They just "rode along" on their reputation, maintained the impeccable quality of their products and kept their prices higher than the other makers without entering the fray. At least that is my impression.

 

The fact that Takahashi was imitating the lens cell attributes of Nikon, or more likely, the masterful designs of Zeiss, says that they were coming on strong, nipping at the heels of their elders Nikon and Goto.

 

It is challenging to go back in time and leap across the cultural barriers to read the situation in Japan in the 1970’s. But it makes a fascinating pastime, doesn’t it?

 

Your efforts here are much appreciated, Don! I look forward to hearing more about the head-to-head performance of these scopes.

[ccwemyss]

We should remember that this was the 1970's and 80's. At that time the 80mm refractor was the flagship of the line. Companies like Goto and Takahashi had a huge investment in the design of their 80mm refractors and they took the competition seriously. I don't know why Nikon would neglect to promote an innovation like ED glass vigorously. But they seem to have been "above it all" in some sense. They also seem to have been rather non-responsive to the price competition offered by the other companies. They just "rode along" on their reputation, maintained the impeccable quality of their products and kept their prices higher than the other makers without entering the fray. At least that is my impression.

 

Pentax was similar in their approach. Working in a shop that was a Pentax dealer in the early 80's, we saw them heavily marketing their cameras and binoculars, but they never seemed to feature their telescopes. People would come in knowing about both the other Pentax lines and about Celestron, Meade, etc., and be surprised to discover that Pentax also made telescopes. Their scopes were also priced well above the competition. We knew how wonderful their optics were, but it was hard to convince a customer that it was worth paying more for an 85mm refractor than a C8. The ones who would listen were those who had also bought Zeiss binoculars. But then we were fighting their perception that Pentax binoculars were second rate. 

 

Chip W. 

[clamchip]

Most of my wife's birding friends switched from Questar field model spotters to Pentax 100mm triplet spotters

years ago. The word must have been out to buy this scope.

They meet here once in a while and the Q's had been replaced by that time otherwise I would have joined this

band of twitcher's so I could be surrounded by a gaggle with Questar's.  The big Pentax spotter is awesome. 

 

Robert

Edited by clamchip, 22 January 2024 - 01:34 PM.

[Dave Trott]

I agree with you, Chip. Pentax scopes are a bit underappreciated here in the US but they made superior telescopes. I think your point is very well-taken. Both Pentax and Nikon seem to have been concentrating on the much broader and therefore more lucrative camera market. Apparently, telescopes were just an afterthought. Pentax seems to have been a bit more quirky. Some of their designs seem downright strange even today. It’s as if the telescope was just a big, fancy camera lens. The EDHF 75 is a prime example with its integrated field flattener lens. They almost demanded that you buy an expensive large format Pentax camera to slap on the back of that puppy.

Pentax was not shy about announcing the fact that it was an ED scope, though. I am still mystified about Nikon and their closed-mouth attitude. You would think they would be loudly trumpeting an ED lens. It is because the Nikon ED lens was so much earlier??

[deSitter]

I agree with you, Chip. Pentax scopes are a bit underappreciated here in the US but they made superior telescopes. I think your point is very well-taken. Both Pentax and Nikon seem to have been concentrating on the much broader and therefore more lucrative camera market. Apparently, telescopes were just an afterthought. Pentax seems to have been a bit more quirky. Some of their designs seem downright strange even today. It’s as if the telescope was just a big, fancy camera lens. The EDHF 75 is a prime example with its integrated field flattener lens. They almost demanded that you buy an expensive large format Pentax camera to slap on the back of that puppy.

Pentax was not shy about announcing the fact that it was an ED scope, though. I am still mystified about Nikon and their closed-mouth attitude. You would think they would be loudly trumpeting an ED lens. It is because the Nikon ED lens was so much earlier??

Nikon likely felt that such things were beneath them

 

BTW Zeiss had a "Type A" apochromat which was basically an ED scope. In the 1920s. I have no information about the type of glass. It provided typical ED performance of about 3x better color correction than a crown-flint achromat. Apparently the glass was unstable and prone to lots of fungus.

 

-drl

[aoirotukiko]

Hi

 

One of the distinctive features of the Nikon 8cm Astronomical Telescope is its mount.

The microadjustment mechanism is full-circle and equipped with a graduated level.

The design registration for the mount was applied for in January 1967 and was registered in March 1968.

It was created by Yoshida Sueo.     
     
Nikon delivered a 25cm astronomical telescope in 1971.

This was a semi-apochromat telescope with a newly developed mount.

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