353 replies to this topic

[cskozlowski]

I already have the PRO license and the latest version as of today.  I was able to open the .txt file in the sequencer and it populated it, then edit.  I then "save as" to the proper file format (.scs).

 

Thank you to those who put the work into the scripts and then shared them.  

 

Does anyone have a idea though how much disk space for the files will be required running this script?

Great.  Word of warning,  the REPEAT UNTIL function in the script needs UTC time (not local time).  I am currently fixing this in my script.  The WAIT UNTIL AFTER function uses local time.  This makes for a bit of a mess in the script.

[cskozlowski]

I have discovered a bug in the 'REPEAT UNTIL' and 'WAIT UNTIL AFTER' script functions.  The 'REPEAT UNTIL' uses UTC time and the 'WAIT UNTIL AFTER' uses local time.  This makes for some issues in my current script.  I am in the process of fixing my script based on these issues. 

[markmanner]

I have discovered a bug in the 'REPEAT UNTIL' and 'WAIT UNTIL AFTER' script functions.  The 'REPEAT UNTIL' uses UTC time and the 'WAIT UNTIL AFTER' uses local time.  This makes for some issues in my current script.  I am in the process of fixing my script based on these issues. 

Can UTC be used for all commands? Or will you need to use one or the other depending upon 'repeat' or 'wait'?  I'm going to have a sunny day tomorrow, and will do some testing of my ability to use a script in Sharpcap. I'm sure I'll learn a good bit (hopefully).

[cskozlowski]

Here's a copy of the latest version of my Sequence (using SharpCap Pro of it makes any difference?) and imaging using a 92mm f/5.3 refractor and an ASI2600MC.  This is the 20th version of my sequence. I've been practicing with this setup under the sun, moon and inside over the last 18 months or so. Lately, I've been concentrating on running totality simulations using EclipseDroid (Android app) which nicely times totality from 1m 30s before C2 and gives me warnings for C2, mid eclipse, C3, etc. It also lists % obscuration which are useful for estimating what features to concentrate on.  There are many other apps that can do this; for example Solar Eclipse Timer and Eclipse 2.0.   EclipseDroid can also control a DSLR from my phone if I so wished.

I could implement "Wait for Time" right at the beginning of it, but I'm comfortable that triggering the Sequence 20 secs before C2 gets me roughly to the right exposure settings depending on the feature visible. Obviously this will vary depending on one's setup, frame rate speed of read-out, PC write speed, USB traffic, etc. Practice makes perfect!

This sequence will capture some 4000 frames for me to review and stack. All at 0 gain and 16-bit format. 

There's nothing preventing the above going t*ts up though, so consider all lucky imaging and take it as it comes. I'll press Run 20 secs before totality and will forget about it for 4 and 1/2 minutes!

 

Roberto

Roberto,

 

Really great work.   I highly recommend a 'WAIT UNTIL AFTER' function in your script.  As we both know, there is quite a bit that occurs starting 30 seconds before totality (taking off solar filters etc.).  Using your 'finger press' to kick off the process is subject to some issues at the time of the event. 

[R Botero]

Roberto, are you seeing a need to mess with focus throughout your testing? Or just focused on timing and storage/ speed

I'm currently planning on using a William Optics 70mm Zenithstar (430 mm FL reduced down to 340mm with a 0.8x reducer), though waffling on using the reducer or not. Will use a ZWO ASI071MC. Will be somewhere in Arkansas, just making the call the night before on where.

I'm currently using the Solar Eclipse Timer app on Android for my timing testing.

I'm thinking of doing the same thing and manually triggering the totality portion like you called out.

I'm planning to do a final touch up of my focus just prior to taking the white filter off (Baader film) before C2. Then will not touch anything besides pressing Run and Stop after totality finishes.

Roberto

[JethroXP]

Weird sequence question (posting on sharpcap forum too), if I am using the "wait until" delay action, it appropriately is using the localtime of my machine, but the "loop until" repeat action is using UTC.

 

Anyone else seeing that in their testing, or is there a setting somewhere maybe I have overlooked?

 

In this case, told it to wait until 11:33 PM which it does, but had to set it to 5:34 AM (UTC is +6 hours for me) to loop for 1 minute and technically end at 11:34

Be carful with "Wait until".  I found that having one at the very beginning is fine, assuming you plan to start ahead of time, but within the script I switched to "Wait until later than" because if any one action runs too long and extends beyond the next "wait until" the entire script will stall at that point.  I also avoided repeat and loop commands so that I could more precisely control the flow.

Edited by JethroXP, 12 February 2024 - 09:44 AM.

[markmanner]

I'm planning to do a final touch up of my focus just prior to taking the white filter off (Baader film) before C2. Then will not touch anything besides pressing Run and Stop after totality finishes.

Roberto

Roberto, I assume based on your testing that your overall sequence, started as you intend, will begin the exposure changes near C3 on time. I'll run the script I prepare for my system multiple times over the next few weeks to confirm that on my notebook that it takes the same time every time. Thanks for sharing this and for your help on it in general.

Best,

Mark

[cskozlowski]

Be carful with "Wait until".  I found that having one at the very beginning is fine, assuming you plan to start ahead of time, but within the script I switched to "Wait until later than" because if any one action runs too long and extends beyond the next "wait until" the entire script will stall at that point.  I also avoided repeat and loop commands so that I could more precisely control the flow.

Thanks to your script,  I am using 'Wait Until Later Than' for that very same reason.  I am using loops (Repeat Until) and have discovered they use UTC Time instead of Local Time - I have them working correctly at this point. 

[R Botero]

Roberto, I assume based on your testing that your overall sequence, started as you intend, will begin the exposure changes near C3 on time. I'll run the script I prepare for my system multiple times over the next few weeks to confirm that on my notebook that it takes the same time every time. Thanks for sharing this and for your help on it in general.

Best,

Mark

Mark

 

I click Run (or will use Wait Time perhaps), 20 seconds before C2.  That way I have the camera running when Diamond Ring/Baily's Beads start showing.  I have those timed to take me into C2 when I then turn to Chromosphere/Prominences, then onwards to Coronae to different extensions and then earthshine and then back so that when C3 approaches I'm in an exposure run for Diamond Rings again.

Using the EclipseDroid App, I can see where the Moon is over the Sun in exact (simulated time) and have been running my Sequence against it with my camera connected to the imaging laptop I'll take.   My Sequences produces close to 4000 frames and around 43GB of data.

 

Roberto

[markmanner]

Mark

 

I click Run (or will use Wait Time perhaps), 20 seconds before C2.  That way I have the camera running when Diamond Ring/Baily's Beads start showing.  I have those timed to take me into C2 when I then turn to Chromosphere/Prominences, then onwards to Coronae to different extensions and then earthshine and then back so that when C3 approaches I'm in an exposure run for Diamond Rings again.

Using the EclipseDroid App, I can see where the Moon is over the Sun in exact (simulated time) and have been running my Sequence against it with my camera connected to the imaging laptop I'll take.   My Sequences produces close to 4000 frames and around 43GB of data.

 

Roberto

I'll start my timing tests. I would guess that there will be some timing differences between different notebook computers and SSDs. 

Thanks again for sharing your output. 

Mark

[JethroXP]

Mark

 

I click Run (or will use Wait Time perhaps), 20 seconds before C2.  That way I have the camera running when Diamond Ring/Baily's Beads start showing.  I have those timed to take me into C2 when I then turn to Chromosphere/Prominences, then onwards to Coronae to different extensions and then earthshine and then back so that when C3 approaches I'm in an exposure run for Diamond Rings again.

Using the EclipseDroid App, I can see where the Moon is over the Sun in exact (simulated time) and have been running my Sequence against it with my camera connected to the imaging laptop I'll take.   My Sequences produces close to 4000 frames and around 43GB of data.

 

Roberto

I’d be concerned about waiting until only 20 seconds prior to click “start”. I use “wait until later than” commands throughout my script, and plan to start it probably 30-minutes prior to C1 to put it “autopilot” so I can focus on other things.  But I’ll also have four rigs running so I already know my attention will be split.  The more I can setup ahead of time as “fire and forget” the better.

[markmanner]

I'll start my timing tests. I would guess that there will be some timing differences between different notebook computers and SSDs. 

Thanks again for sharing your output. 

Mark

FWIW, when I run Roberto's script on my system, which has the same camera he is using, it overall runs in 3:50 on one pc, and 4:15 on the other. Fortunately, the smaller PC is the one that runs faster, so after I tweak the settings to get the timing right, I'll take it.  I'll perhaps increase the number of frames captured so that the overall sequence takes 4:30. In Mazatlan, the timings appear to be 4:16 or so, and that will mean I'd start the sequence about 15 seconds before C2.

 

Roberto, one thing you mentioned that I don't see is 200fps on the smaller ROIs. I'm getting around 26fps on the 2088x2088 ROI. Even at that, the timing of the overall sequence is close to what is needed. I may have misread your fps comment.  
Mark

Edited by markmanner, 13 February 2024 - 12:51 PM.

[R Botero]

That must have been a typo on my side Mark. The ASI2600MC cannot do that fast a frame rate. As for total length, just add more brackets to the exposure ladders in case any of my exposure guesses don't work!

Roberto

Edited by R Botero, 13 February 2024 - 01:48 PM.

[markmanner]

That must have been a typo on my side Mark. The ASI2600MC cannot do that fast a frame rate. As for total length, just add more brackets to the exposure ladders in case any of my exposure guesses don't work!

Roberto

I'm experimenting now, adding some brackets symmetrically.  I'll shoot for a 'press the start button' at 15 sec before, and then, as you said, forget about it!

I do get 200fps with a small ROI on my ASI 585MC I use for planetary imaging.

 

I think I mentioned the pain I experienced imaging the annular eclipse with a really large number of SER files I took for the 2.4 hr duration. The number generated here won't be an issue to process. 

 

As for temperature of the camera, the predictions for Mazatlan in April are low 19C to high 27C, so I'll probably use a 10C set point. 

[markmanner]

Mark

 

I click Run (or will use Wait Time perhaps), 20 seconds before C2.  That way I have the camera running when Diamond Ring/Baily's Beads start showing.  I have those timed to take me into C2 when I then turn to Chromosphere/Prominences, then onwards to Coronae to different extensions and then earthshine and then back so that when C3 approaches I'm in an exposure run for Diamond Rings again.

Using the EclipseDroid App, I can see where the Moon is over the Sun in exact (simulated time) and have been running my Sequence against it with my camera connected to the imaging laptop I'll take.   My Sequences produces close to 4000 frames and around 43GB of data.

 

Roberto

Roberto, I've modified your script to make it work timing-wise for my particular notebook and SSD. Here is the script as it exists as of today for my 92mm refractor operating at 489mm FL with an ASI2600MC. It runs repeatably in 5:20 and generates 63.4 GB of data in 19 SER 16bit files, and approximately 5150 frames (several different ROIs as you noted). I'll trigger it 30 seconds before predicted C2 and let it go. My only concern at this point (assuming no equipment failures that day) are the exposures selected. I don't know how to accurately validate them since we don't have an eclipse available. They seem reasonable. It would have been nice if someone had used a 2600MC camera on the eclipse in 2017, but of course it wasn't available then. On a test today, using that setup and a Baader solar filter, I got a properly exposed uneclipsed disk using 0.05ms exposures. I'll compare that to the helpful information that Gordon at Foxwoodastronomy has shared.  I also will look at the xjubier exposure calculator website you mentioned in one of your posts earlier to confirm the settings.  I also have an old Thousand Oaks glass solar filter that will fit my refractor, so I may use it instead. I'll test uneclipsed sun images with both.

Attached Files

•  4.8.2024_EclipseScriptdraft2.14.24.txt   2.05KB   92 downloads

Edited by markmanner, 14 February 2024 - 07:52 PM.

[JethroXP]

Roberto, I've modified your script to make it work timing-wise for my particular notebook and SSD. Here is the script as it exists as of today for my 92mm refractor operating at 489mm FL with an ASI2600MC. It runs repeatably in 5:20 and generates 63.4 GB of data in 19 SER 16bit files, and approximately 5150 frames (several different ROIs as you noted). I'll trigger it 30 seconds before predicted C2 and let it go. My only concern at this point (assuming no equipment failures that day) are the exposures selected. I don't know how to accurately validate them since we don't have an eclipse available. They seem reasonable. It would have been nice if someone had used a 2600MC camera on the eclipse in 2017, but of course it wasn't available then. On a test today, using that setup and a Baader solar filter, I got a properly exposed uneclipsed disk using 0.05ms exposures. I'll compare that to the helpful information that Gordon at Foxwoodastronomy has shared.  I also will look at the xjubier exposure calculator website you mentioned in one of your posts earlier to confirm the settings.  I also have an old Thousand Oaks glass solar filter that will fit my refractor, so I may use it instead. I'll test uneclipsed sun images with both.

I took a look at your script.  I'm concerned that you are relying on the execution time of each capture to align with the timing of the various phenomena.  Even if under normal conditions the execution times do line up, it still means you have only one chance to start the script at precisely the correct time to have it execute those exposure times and ROI changes in perfect alignment with the actual event.  I'd recommend using the "Wait until" or "Wait until later than" command, at least at the start, so that you can start the script with plenty of time before the event, and it will just wait until the precise time you specify to start executing.  Better yet would be to add those times throughout.

[R Botero]

I took a look at your script.  I'm concerned that you are relying on the execution time of each capture to align with the timing of the various phenomena.  Even if under normal conditions the execution times do line up, it still means you have only one chance to start the script at precisely the correct time to have it execute those exposure times and ROI changes in perfect alignment with the actual event.  I'd recommend using the "Wait until" or "Wait until later than" command, at least at the start, so that you can start the script with plenty of time before the event, and it will just wait until the precise time you specify to start executing.  Better yet would be to add those times throughout.

Jason

 

You do realise we are continuously taking pictures from 15/20 seconds before C2 and all the way past C3?   Triggering single shots or a set of them using "Wait until.." certainly solves the problem of starting at a particular point but I don't think there's a right or wrong way of doing this.  I know you have several rigs going so I do agree having everything automated is the optimal solution but for those of us using a single scope and camera, there will always be that press of a button to get things going at some point. 

 

You did raise the point of latency in acquiring images through a script vs live view and Robin confirmed it was faster in live view.  That's why I chose Sequencer last year as the base for my tests (and the fact that I am no programmer...).   I am not aware of any software/app that will exactly predict when the Baily's beads, diamond rings, prominences (if any), etc will be visible.  I can only see ranges or approximate timings.  By having the cameras imaging continuously through those ranges we can at least ensure they have been captured if they occurred.   The main unknown remains the exposure.  Xavier Jubier's excellent webpage gives very definite indications for DSLRs exposures but CMOS are fairly new and the ASI2600MC was not around for 2017 as Mark points out.  The nearest I found to an astronomical CMOS camera being used with excellent results is Miloslav Druckmüller and Peter Aniol's 2019 shot with an ASI1600MM here:  http://www.zam.fme.v...47mm/0-info.htm   They are the masters of imaging eclipses and have proprietary software to HDR compose the different exposure levels.  That was a shot with a monochrome camera and 0.001s to 1.024s single shots as far as I can see and fast optics.  I am exposing well below and above those ranges.  I never had an ASI1600MM and can't compare it with an ASI2600MC.  I would expect the newer camera to at least be faster in readout but maybe I am aiming too low in the exposures to begin with....I will know in the afternoon of 8 April! 

 

Roberto

[markmanner]

I took a look at your script.  I'm concerned that you are relying on the execution time of each capture to align with the timing of the various phenomena.  Even if under normal conditions the execution times do line up, it still means you have only one chance to start the script at precisely the correct time to have it execute those exposure times and ROI changes in perfect alignment with the actual event.  I'd recommend using the "Wait until" or "Wait until later than" command, at least at the start, so that you can start the script with plenty of time before the event, and it will just wait until the precise time you specify to start executing.  Better yet would be to add those times throughout.

Hi Jason, thanks for your comments, I appreciate them given we are all trying to make this work!  I also saw Roberto's reply. Since we can't predict with total accuracy when events are going to occur in advance (those that occur near the limb pre and post totality in particular), even using specific timing triggers are an educated guess.  Since the streams I'm taking are spread over time and with different exposures, I think I'll have a good chance of being on top of the event I'm trying to image. My main concern when I started looking at the script, was whether without specific sub timing triggers would it be consistent enough run to run.  However, I've run it more than 25 times now, inside on the bench and outside attached to my telescope under the sun, using the power supplies, cables and settings that I'll be using on eclipse day. The capture sequence runs the same duration every time, plus or minus a second or less, over the 319 second duration. I am getting about 5150 16-bit images in the 19 SER streams during the run, with many different exposure durations set. Of course, with only one setup, I'm subject to equipment failure that day, but given the need to travel by air, one is all I'll take. I'm optimistic I'll get a reasonable image or two, but if I don't, then that is ok. 

Edited by markmanner, 15 February 2024 - 10:26 AM.

[markmanner]

For those using ZWO cameras such as the 2600MC and Sharpcap, what settings are you using for White Bal (B ), White Bal (R ), and Brightness? I'm using 0 gain, which I believe most are doing. My Sharpcap settings now have White Bal (B)=90 (AUTO), White Bal (R )=50 (AUTO) and Brightness of 50.  

Edited by markmanner, 15 February 2024 - 02:56 PM.

[SteveInNZ]

The main unknown remains the exposure.

Roberto,

Do you have a DSLR that you can put on your telescope ?
Go outside and take photos of the moon and find an exposure time/ISO that you like.

Now put your astro camera on and set the exposure time to the same value. Adjust the Gain to get a good exposure.

Now you know that ISO X = Gain Y. Put that value of ISO into Xavier's calculator.

 

Or you can work that backwards (starting with a Gain and finding an ISO) and you could use a grey card or just a daytime scene.

 

For my ASI1600MC, a Gain of 139 is equivalent to an ISO of 500.

 

Steve.

[R Botero]

Hi Steve

Thanks. Never had a DSLR unfortunately. I started with digital cameras and imaging by making a Cookbook CCD using Richard Berry's recipe in the mid 90s!
I did try to figure out what exposure to use by imaging the earthshine during a waxing Moon as I've read elsewhere that capturing it is equivalent to the mid corona in terms of exposure. Then I worked backwards to match an ISO in Xavier's website for the other exposures.
Roberto

[JethroXP]

Jason

 

You do realise we are continuously taking pictures from 15/20 seconds before C2 and all the way past C3?   Triggering single shots or a set of them using "Wait until.." certainly solves the problem of starting at a particular point but I don't think there's a right or wrong way of doing this.  I know you have several rigs going so I do agree having everything automated is the optimal solution but for those of us using a single scope and camera, there will always be that press of a button to get things going at some point. 

 

You did raise the point of latency in acquiring images through a script vs live view and Robin confirmed it was faster in live view.  That's why I chose Sequencer last year as the base for my tests (and the fact that I am no programmer...).   I am not aware of any software/app that will exactly predict when the Baily's beads, diamond rings, prominences (if any), etc will be visible.  I can only see ranges or approximate timings.  By having the cameras imaging continuously through those ranges we can at least ensure they have been captured if they occurred.   The main unknown remains the exposure.  Xavier Jubier's excellent webpage gives very definite indications for DSLRs exposures but CMOS are fairly new and the ASI2600MC was not around for 2017 as Mark points out.  The nearest I found to an astronomical CMOS camera being used with excellent results is Miloslav Druckmüller and Peter Aniol's 2019 shot with an ASI1600MM here:  http://www.zam.fme.v...47mm/0-info.htm   They are the masters of imaging eclipses and have proprietary software to HDR compose the different exposure levels.  That was a shot with a monochrome camera and 0.001s to 1.024s single shots as far as I can see and fast optics.  I am exposing well below and above those ranges.  I never had an ASI1600MM and can't compare it with an ASI2600MC.  I would expect the newer camera to at least be faster in readout but maybe I am aiming too low in the exposures to begin with....I will know in the afternoon of 8 April! 

 

Roberto

I do realize that, but I'm wondering if you realize that simply taking pictures all the way through totality isn't the issue, it's matching the exposure length to the specific phenomena, which in some cases last for only a few seconds?  So timing is pretty critical.  If you are a few seconds, late, or early in starting, or if the sequence runs faster or slower than you expect, you'll end up with a lot of images that don't capture what you were hoping to capture.  That's why even if you are very confident in the pace at which it executes, you should still put a specific start time at the beginning so you can start it early, and know that it will run at that exact moment and not be reliant on you pressing a button at a specific time.

I'm not suggesting you abandon your .ser file live image captures, I'm only suggesting adding a single "wait until" or "wait until later than" at the beginning to free yourself from trying to time a manual start.

There is in fact software that will precisely predict the phenomena times from a specified location.  I'm using Eclipse Orchestrator (PC) and there is also Solar Eclipse Maestro for Mac.  EO will manage the sequence on my Nikon Z6, but I was also able to use it to produce the timings for my RedCat51/ASI2600MC that I'm using in my SharpCap sequence.  The authors of both pieces of software (including Xavier Jubier who wrote Solar Eclipse Maestro) just gave a demonstration here:

https://www.youtube....h?v=qLHfURDO1YY

That video is well worth the time for everyone trying to automate their sequences.

Also keep in mind that modern DSLRs, and Mirrorless cameras like the Nikon Z6 *are* CMOS cameras.  In fact the ZWO ASI2400MC (their full frame camera prior to the 6200MC) uses the exact same sensor as my Nikon Z6.  These are not different beasts, they are just packaged differently.  

[JethroXP]

Hi Jason, thanks for your comments, I appreciate them given we are all trying to make this work!  I also saw Roberto's reply. Since we can't predict with total accuracy when events are going to occur in advance (those that occur near the limb pre and post totality in particular), even using specific timing triggers are an educated guess.  Since the streams I'm taking are spread over time and with different exposures, I think I'll have a good chance of being on top of the event I'm trying to image. My main concern when I started looking at the script, was whether without specific sub timing triggers would it be consistent enough run to run.  However, I've run it more than 25 times now, inside on the bench and outside attached to my telescope under the sun, using the power supplies, cables and settings that I'll be using on eclipse day. The capture sequence runs the same duration every time, plus or minus a second or less, over the 319 second duration. I am getting about 5150 16-bit images in the 19 SER streams during the run, with many different exposure durations set. Of course, with only one setup, I'm subject to equipment failure that day, but given the need to travel by air, one is all I'll take. I'm optimistic I'll get a reasonable image or two, but if I don't, then that is ok. 

Hey Mark, I think this is where both you and Roberto might be unaware that in fact there are tools to precisely predict when the events will occur.  Check the video I posted in my reply to Roberto.  In it Xavier Jubier gives a very detailed walk through of his software and explains how it works and how he was able to improve on the timing precision.

[markmanner]

Hey Mark, I think this is where both you and Roberto might be unaware that in fact there are tools to precisely predict when the events will occur.  Check the video I posted in my reply to Roberto.  In it Xavier Jubier gives a very detailed walk through of his software and explains how it works and how he was able to improve on the timing precision.

Hi Jason, I am aware of those tools, and they are the basis for when I plan on starting and the duration and exposure settings for the streams that I hope to be on top of the BB and DR events. My comment was that even with those tools, it is an educated prediction and may not be precise, and as a result I don't see the difference between starting the script manually at a specific time vs having a time entry in the script that starts it at that time (assuming I'm not asleep at the switch of course ).  As Roberto mentioned, he and I have only one setup and will be attentive to the starting time.  

[rocketdmc]

Thanks to your script,  I am using 'Wait Until Later Than' for that very same reason.  I am using loops (Repeat Until) and have discovered they use UTC Time instead of Local Time - I have them working correctly at this point. 

Where is the 'Wait Until Later Than' command? I can't seem to find it in the sequence editor.