132 replies to this topic

[astrocapture]

Compliments!
I would like information on the app.
1) Will other options be added such as ROI, 12 bit (ser and fit), etc...?
2) Progressively, will compatibility be extended to all ASI models, including USB 2.0 ones like the old 120 MM?
3) Do you plan to make the app compatible with any webcam/USB camera, or will it remain usable only via ASI cameras?

Hello @antarex,

 

Only to tell you that with the new release 2.3, the ROI (Region Of Interest) feature is now implemented

 

 

After pressing the ROI button a rectangle shows the sensor maximum resolution and the FOV (Field Of View). Can be moved around to change the Region of Interest and can be hidden by pression the ROI button again. The FOV is the actual resolution multiplied by the current binning setting.

 

Thanks again for your valuable feedback.

[antarex]

Hello @antarex

 

You are welcome to ask questions. The philosophy behind Astro Capture is to keep it community driven.

 

1a) ROI is not currently implemented, but is a great idea. I'll add it to the feature backlog.

1b) 8/16 bit images are already supported, if your sensor is 12 bit then choose 16 bit to save all the data.

1c) Ser / Fit formats are not supported yet. Images are saved as standard 8/16 bit TIFF files that are better supported by 3rd party softwares and other non-astronomical apps.

1d) Ser video recording requires a tablet / smartphone with USB 3 and a fast memory to keep a decent framerate and such devices are not very common yet.

2) Device support is actually determined by the official Zwo Sdk for Android. If a Zwo device is not supported, there are no chances to have it working.

3a) The app is designed to support additional Sdk from other brands, but at this time Zwo only is providing an Android Sdk. What camera would you like to use with the app?

3b) Generic webcam/USB cameras can be easily used by other apps, I don't think the effort to support them is worth at this time.

 

Thanks again for your questions, let me know if you have any other suggestion or concern.

I thank you for the answer. And for the addition of the ROI function
So, only the ASI cameras which were supported by the asicap app, can be supported by the astro capture app. I understand.

I thought the old 120mm and 120 mc asi, which are USB 2.0, were also supported with this app.
Support that wasn't there with ASI CAP, because only USB 3.0 cameras were compatible

 

Is there a possibility to add vertical display? And an exit button, to close the app?

 

One last thing... do you think it's possible to implement live stacking of photo shots? EAA

 

Thank you

Edited by antarex, 03 March 2024 - 05:05 AM.

[astrocapture]

Hello @antarex

 

I guess the communication protocol is a bit different and some reverse engineering effort would be required to make the app compatible. I don't have any ASI 120MM or 120MC so I can't help with these devices.

 

Vertical mode (portrait) is not supported because there are many elements on the UI and they won't fit well. I suggest to use a magic arm and a phone/tablet holder to freely orient your phone. An external shutter button is supported also and can help to avoid vibrations.

 

Exit button is not required because you can just close the app in the usual Android way. No services are running in background, so when the app is closed, is closed. Keep in mind that the camera will still absorb current while connected so please disconnect it when not in use.

 

Live Stacking is not a planned feature because the philosophy of the app is to capture Raw data at the maximum quality / frame rate using less energy possible to extend the phone/tablet battery.

All processing are to be done on a computer that can offer better computation power and won't have battery issues.

 

OpenLiveStacker can already be used for Live Stacking and you can have both app installed.

 

You are welcome

[astrocapture]

Compliments!
I would like information on the app.
1) Will other options be added such as ROI, 12 bit (ser and fit), etc...?
2) Progressively, will compatibility be extended to all ASI models, including USB 2.0 ones like the old 120 MM?
3) Do you plan to make the app compatible with any webcam/USB camera, or will it remain usable only via ASI cameras?

Hello @antarex,

 

Only to tell you that Astro Capture v2.4 is now available with the suggested feature

 

 

- Video recording available (.SER format, RAW8 / RAW16)

- ROI changing and Photo shooting available while recording video

- Video recording automatically stop when free disk space is less than 32 Megabytes

- Minor improvements

 

Cheers

Edited by astrocapture, 06 March 2024 - 04:13 PM.

[antarex]

Perfect!

Soon. I will test the app, with an asi224MC and an asi 120MM.

Thank you

[antarex]

I tried to use the app on a Samsung Galaxy S10 plus, with the original adapter, and an ASI224MC connected with the original USB 3.0 cable.
The camera is not recognized, it says "not connected".

[astrocapture]

Hello,

 

This is pretty common with ASI camera* because they use some startup power and phones sometimes can't provide it and they disable the USB OTG until the phone is restarted.

 

You can try to:

1) Fully charge your phone and restart Android. Try to disable wifi and the data connection to lower the power consumption

2) Connect the adapter and the cable to the phone, DO NOT connect the camera to the cable (keep it floating)

3) Connect the ASI camera

4) Run the app and connect to the camera

5) Enable back the data connection and wifi if needed

 

If this is not working, try to reverse upside the connector and try again. If also this is not working, please try another cable / phone.

I had this kind of experience with few smartphones with an old battery that wasn't able to provide enough power. After this procedure they worked too.

 

Cheers

 

* I guess this is the reason why ZWO dropped Android support, maybe they were unable / was too time consuming to manage non-working devices

Edited by astrocapture, 07 March 2024 - 04:53 PM.

[antarex]

OK, I will try.

I also tried the latest version of the asicap app that came out, always using the Samsung Galaxy S10 plus with the original white adapter, and the ASI224MC connected with the original USB 3.0 cable.

The room is recognized, but even with the official zwo app there are problems.

I ask you... maybe knowing the asicap app, you can give me the answers.

 

PROBLEMS WITH ASICAP APP:

 

1) I noticed that the exposure cannot be adjusted over 1s (1000ms).

 

2) the resolution cannot be set it under 640x480.
Is there a way to unlock the exposure and resolution?

 

3) There are no contrast and gamma options. But only the offset option.

 

4) The video FPS level is very limited, much less than via USB 2.0 from a PC.

Does it depend on the limitations of the app? the original white adapter of galaxy S10 it's just usb 2.0? battery level? smartphone?

With the PC, there are no FPS problems and it is very fast.

 

5) In advaced mode, what does "limit usb" refer to? there are 4 voices (40-60-80-100) and by default it is set to 40

 

6) In advaced mode, what does "high speed" refer to? if active, the fps does not change

 

If astro capture was able to recognize the camera, is there a risk that I will have the same limitations found and listed with asicap app?

 

Thank you

Edited by antarex, 08 March 2024 - 02:23 AM.

[astrocapture]

Hello @antarex,

 

1) AstroCapture supports exposures up to 60 seconds. Asicap maximum exposure is 1 second.

 

2) AstroCapture supports low resolutions down to 320x240 for much higher fps. Asicap minimum resolution is 640x480 and high fps can't be reached during recording on low-end smartphones.

 

3) Contrast and Gamma are display settings only and won't affect captured data. You can increase the display brightness to better see dark areas in both app. These features are not implemented on AstroCapture because they slow down the framerate.

 

4) Many smartphones processing power and USB bandwidth is very limited compared to computers. You need a faster phone (with USB 3) to capture higher framerates.

 

5) Limit USB is to limit the USB bandwidth used by the camera. If your device can't handle 100% you can lower it to avoid dropping frames. 40% is a bit low and you will get very low fps, Astrocapture use an higher default settings for an higher fps.

 

6) High-speed is to use the ADC in low-resolution mode when the frame rate is limited by the sensor speed. With smartphones the bottleneck is the USB connection/processing power so there is no need to enable this mode.

 

7) AstroCapture is not interacting with Asicap so you can have both installed and they won't conflict each other. There is no risk of limitations.

 

 

As always, let me know if you would any additional AstroCapture feature (ex. smaller resolution 160x120, gamma display setting, etc.. )

 

 

Note: I'm NOT working for ZWO and I don't recommend using the discontinued Asicap. The app AstroCapture is the supported way to go.

 

The original USB 3.0 cable (red one) from my tests is too long and is causing connection troubles with some smartphones.

 

After fixing any USB cable / power issue the camera will work in both apps, because USB OTG is managed by Android.

 

On the market there are some cheap "USB tester" that can help you to troubleshoot Asi camera power issues, see image below for an example

 

 

You are welcome

Edited by astrocapture, 08 March 2024 - 10:12 AM.

[antarex]

I thank you for the answer.

Let's say that the exposure limit is 1s, and the resolution is limited to 640x480. They greatly limit the possible use of asicap app. Besides the fact that it is now obsolete.

 

Going back to astro capture... I installed the app again and it correctly recognizes the asi224 mc.

I come to the considerations and questions:

 

1) I used the Galaxy S10 plus again (which should transfer compatible with USB 3.0) together with its adapter (the original white one, which is perhaps only USB 2.0?) , and I connected them with a USB 3.0 output cable to a USB 3.0 HUB. I then connected the asi224 mc camera in input with its USB 3.0 cable, to the same 3.0 HUB.

Even using the HUB 3.0, to power the camera separately, the fps are very low! half compared to asicap app!

At maximum resolution 1304x976, with RAW8. The fps are around 7-8 variables. With asicap app instead 14 fps, is still very low but almost double. And the fps are higher in the asicap app, at all resolutions and even with RAW16.

Why are the fps lower with astro capture, compared to asicap app?

 

2) The possibility of setting NO LIMIT to the frames in video recordings, should be added. There is a limit of 1000 frames now.

 

3) Could the debayer be added to the display view? Even with the asi224mc which is a color camera, I see mono on the display even with RAW8. The shots (wiht SAVE RAW) are also mono, and it's not just a matter of previewing on the display.

 

4) If I click on RECORD, to record videos the app crashes.

 

5) What is the function of NO DELAY? Shutter delay to avoid vibrations?

 

6) Does OFFSET correspond to brightness? I found it set to 10, is it better to leave it like this and not change the value?

 

7) Could contrast, gamma and color balance options be added?

 

8) Could you add a grid, a reticle, or a point for centering objects?

 

Thank you

Edited by antarex, 09 March 2024 - 02:02 AM.

[astrocapture]

Hello,

 

Thank you for your questions.

 

1) I don't recommend using an USB Hub, the best would be to use an Splitter cable that supports USB 3.

You can search for "USB-C to Standard Type-A USB3.0 Female with PD"

 

 

It's important to have a single USB 3 Data port and a single USB Power Delivery (PD) to avoid bandwidth issues. A splitter is very different from an Hub.

 

With USB PD your phone is charged while connected to the camera, so you can get better performance and avoid any power-saving limitation of Android.

 

Can you send me a screenshoot of settings used during your test? Probably exposure is different and actually limits the maximum fps.

 

There may be still small differences, but AstroCapture is pretty optimized and should perform very well.I won't exclude that Asicap Fps shown are a bit optimistic than real. Try to hide the histogram when not needed and set binning to 1 for the best performance.

 

The biggest performance gain you can have anyway is to ensure that the connection is USB 3 at 5 Gbps.

 

2) Intervals and Delays settings are currently used for photos only. Video recording is controlled by the user and stopped manually. In future releases Intervals and Delays may be affecting the video recording as well (a no limit option will be introduced in this case)

 

3) Debayering is critical for quality and should be done with the best algorithm on a computer. AstroCapture philisophy is to collect RAW data and avoid any further processing to save the phone battery, avoid quality loss, heat issues, etc...

 

4) Sorry to hear that, can you try to set a lower resolution? Can you send me the log.txt file (in the Pictures/AstroCapture folder)

 

5) It's the delay between captured frames and can be used to avoid vibrations as well

 

6) Yes, it's sometimes Brightness and should be incresed when the Gain is increased according to your Camera noise.

 

In few words: some types of noise is random, so let's say can affect the real pixel value by +/-10. When the pixel is completely dark (value of 0) the noise can affect this value bringing it to 0-10=-10. This situation is a problem, because the value is saturated (is seen as a zero, but is actually negative) and stacking / algorithms can do nothing to remove this noise. So the idea is to keep an offset high enough to compensate the negative noise and have all pixels values positive. Gain is multiplying noise as well, so for higher values you need to increase the offset too. This relationship depends on your camera sensor, temperature, etc.. you can use the histogram to find out a reasonable value. The default value of 10 is usually good for a Gain of 100. Too extreme offset values will reduce your dynamic range.

 

7) I don't have an ASI color camera for testing, so I don't think color balance will be added soon. If I manage a way to organize the UI, I can add contrast and gamma, but keep in mind that enabling these options will slow-down the preview. The idea is to keep all options quickly accessible without sub-menus or additional pages, but there is a limit given by the screen resolution.

 

8) Framing options are a great idea! As the previous point, I should think a way to better organize the UI to add them now that the screen is pretty crowded.

 

Thanks

 

[astrocapture]

4) If I click on RECORD, to record videos the app crashes.

 

8) Could you add a grid, a reticle, or a point for centering objects?

 

Thank you

Hello @antarex,

 

Only to tell you that v2.6 is now adding new grid options (No grid, Bull's eye, Thirds grid).

 

 

During zoom operations the grid is kept at the same sensor position (Astrocap for example is not doing this and is impossible to find the sensor center while zooming)

 

Log file is now including crash info from the recording button.

 

Cheers,

 

PS: v2.7 is also out with Histogram improvements

Edited by astrocapture, 10 March 2024 - 05:29 PM.

[antarex]

Thanks for the update.
Returning to what was previously requested...

 

1) If I understand correctly... with the splitter, the smartphone powers the camera. Meanwhile, the smartphone is powered by the power supply. While if you use UHB, the UHB powers the camera, but the smartphone is not powered. Right?

So you recommend me this splitter. Except on aliexpress, I can't find it anywhere else though.

 

2) Unfortunately, the fps continues to be low, even when setting the minimum value of 1/4000. At maximum resolution they always fluctuate around 8 fps.

 

3) Pressing RECORD crashes at any resolution, even the smallest. How can I send you the log file? in the root: Pictures/AstroCapture folder, there is no file.

 

4) Could you add dropped frames, along with the fps speed? The fps are currently displayed at the top left of the screen and half cut off

 

5) It would be useful to add a function to save settings. Every time I close the app "brutally", after when I open it, the default settings load. Because of this, I was wondering if a feature could be added to close the app.

 

For the rest, I understood the other answers to the points in my previous message.

 

Thank you

Edited by antarex, 11 March 2024 - 04:31 AM.

[astrocapture]

Hello,

 

1) Yes, that's correct. I have found the splitter on Amazon, but likely are the same Aliexpress sellers. Please avoid Splitter with additional stuff (Ex. sd-card, more USB data port, audio jack, etc..) because they are hub.
Mine is this model: www.amazon.com/dp/B0CH2WWBQ8 and when connected to a computer I can get up to 15 fps at 3096x2080/RAW16 that's very good for the ASI 178MM.

 

2) I think in your case the issue is the USB 2 cable, but there is room for performance improvements in the app. I'll keep working on improving it.

 

3) Are images saved? You can send log files to support@majinsoft.com

 

4) Fps was recently moved to the top left to make some space for the Grid menu, can you send me a screenshoot of how it looks on your smartphone? Adding a dropped frames is a very good idea!

 

5) I have not added yet this feature because if users select a resolution that's dropping many frames or a very long exposure time, the app will be less reactive. This is probably because longest exposure time is 1sec in Asicap. I need to implement an abort function first for long exposures, then I will enable a restore settings at startup.

 

You are welcome

Edited by astrocapture, 11 March 2024 - 09:42 AM.

[antarex]

Thank you for the replies. Returning to what was written before...

 

1) But by connecting it to a smartphone via the splitter, how many fps does it go?

Of course, having the splitter that powers the smartphone is essential.
By directly connecting the camera to the smartphone, the battery charge drains quickly.

 

2) The USB cable is the original 3.0 from ASI 224MC. The problem is the original adapter (USB C male - USB A female) of the Galaxy S10 Plus, which I fear is USB 2.0.

Although, as I wrote to you, with asicap app the fps are higher at all resolutions.

 

3) I also tried making RAW videos with asicap app. And it crashes! Only MP4 videos are recorded. So I'm afraid it's the same problem with astro capture. That is, it crashes because it doesn't record in RAW.

When the asicap app crashes, a popup appears on my smartphone. Where it says that the app has stopped due to a bug, and to wait for the app to update.

Can you solve the problem?

 

For the rest, I understood the other answers to the points in my previous message.

 

Thank you

[astrocapture]

Hello,

 

1) Depends on your smartphone processing power, but with USB 3.0 you should expect much higher fps, similar to what you get on a computer.

 

2) Please don't use the original adapter if USB 2.0, it's the bottleneck of the whole system. Different Asicap fps may be because of different USB limit settings. USB 3.0 will solve this issue also.

 

3) I tried many devices and they never crashed with Astrocapture video recording. Seems there is something on your phone with writing permissions. Unluckily I can't fix Asicap in any way, but I can improve Astrocapture,

 

 

Is "Save RAW" working on your phone?

 

 

Thanks

Edited by astrocapture, 11 March 2024 - 09:42 AM.

[astrocapture]

Hello,

 

v2.8 is now out. This update is bringing new requested features to track connection performance issues.

 

- UI improvements

- Lost frames counter (displayed when frames are lost)

- USB Connection type (displayed when the camera is connected)

 

 

Cheers

Edited by astrocapture, 11 March 2024 - 12:11 PM.

[astrocapture]

3) I also tried making RAW videos with asicap app. And it crashes! Only MP4 videos are recorded. So I'm afraid it's the same problem with astro capture. That is, it crashes because it doesn't record in RAW.

When the asicap app crashes, a popup appears on my smartphone. Where it says that the app has stopped due to a bug, and to wait for the app to update.

Can you solve the problem?

Hello @antarex,

 

Good news,

 

V3.0 introduces support for Android 14 and fix crashes on newer systems. The video recording crash should be now fixed.

 

Files are also now saved to Download\Astrocapture folder instead of the Pictures.

 

Thanks

Edited by astrocapture, 11 March 2024 - 06:27 PM.

[antarex]

Thank you!

 

I just tried the new version, and I can confirm that there are no more crashes on the recordings.

Very good!

 

The introduction of the new functions is also really useful!

I can confirm that due to the original adapter of the Galaxy S10 Plus, the connection is USB 2.0! The USB connection indicated by the app is in fact, USB 2.0

Then I just need to buy the USB 3.0 splitter you recommended. And I can connect the smartphone, the asi224 mc camera, and keep the smartphone charging at the same time. Well!

 

I'd like to ask you other questions...

 

1) When I take single photo shots (in RAW8 or RAW16), the only saving format is TIFF. There is no option to save them in FITS. Right?

 

2) At the top left the frame counter is cut off on the left side... I don't know how to send you screenshots from your smartphone...

To make you understand... taking the last screen you posted as an example... above are 15/216. in my smartphone the 15 is completely cut off on the edge.
Then another question... what exactly do 15 and 216 represent?

 

3) Now that the save folder has changed. If I click on the GALLERY of the app, it no longer displays anything. It definitely still points towards the old one.

 

For the rest... when I test the actual USB 3.0 connection, I will be able to give you an answer.
And finally, when possible, you can introduce other options such as: contrast, gamma, saturation, color balance, debayer, and saving settings.

One last thing that might come to mind...increase the maximum exposure limit.

 

For the rest, I can't think of anything... except for any bugs that might arise during use.

 

Thank you

Edited by antarex, 11 March 2024 - 09:36 PM.

[antarex]

I'm also trying an old ASI 120MM USB 2.0, but when I connect it to the smartphone it isn't recognized by astro capture!
Even asicap app doesn't recognize it.

Are USB 2.0 cameras not supported?

 

I also tried connecting the ASI120MM USB 2.0, to a USB 3.0 port on the PC under Windows 10, but it is not recognized correctly. And it cannot be used connected to USB 3.0, but only connected to a USB 2.0 port

Maybe the incompatibility with USB 3.0 ports, the reason why astro capture in the Galaxy S10 Plus also doesn't recognize it?

Since the internal controller port of the Galaxy S10, is USB 3.0 (if I'm not mistaken).

Edited by antarex, 11 March 2024 - 11:26 PM.

[astrocapture]

Hello,

 

Very well that now recording is working!

 

v3.1 is out:

 

- fixed the gallery path

 

- adding some additional margin to avoid clipping issues at the border on rounded screens.

 

1) Support for FITS is not ready yet. At this time TIFF is the only supported format, but almost all software are supporting this format.

 

2) You can post the screenshoot on the forum or send it by email to our support. The clipping issue anyway is fixed in v3.1. Two numbers at top left are Min / Max value of the frame (shown as 8 bit). Ex. 15 is the lowest pixel value and 216 is the maximum. They both go from 0 to to 255.

 

3) Fixed in v3.1

 

About maximum exposure: now is 60 seconds, when the shoot abort function will be ready, additional options (ex. 120s, 240s, etc.) and a new "Bulb" mode will be added.

 

Old USB 2.0 devices (ex. ASI 120MM) are not officially supported by the ZWO SDK. May be a commercial than technical limitation, but is this way. It's probably not worth to spend time to get them working.

 

Thanks

Edited by astrocapture, 12 March 2024 - 05:39 AM.

[antarex]

On my S10 (which is rounded on the edges), the problem of clipping the 8-bit frame counter on one side, and the temperature on the other side, persists.

Since I don't read them on sharpcap, for example. But is the 8-bit frame counter really useful? Is used to control the dynamic range?

I think that the fps, the frames actually acquired, and the lost frames... are the most important ones.

I'm just asking to understand.

 

For the discussion of the old ASI120MM usb 2.0 version.

I would be grateful if you could (perhaps when you have time), and If I wanted to give it a try... make this camera compatible with the app too.

 

Thank you

[astrocapture]

Hello,

 

I'll increase the UI margin, **** these new phones are always more rounded!

 

The Min / Max statistics can tell if there are saturated pixels in the image, are useful to adjust the exposure if you don't need the whole histogram.

 

For the ASI120MM compatibility the current way is to reverse engineering, but is very time consuming and I don't have that camera model or plans to buy it.

 

Reverse engineering means that you have to record someway the USB traffic to replicate commands to and from the camera. After that you need to understand what they are doing and reproduce (reimplement) the same behavior in the app on Android. There was an effort to do this 10 years ago here https://github.com/s...erseEngineering, but seems incomplete and abandoned.

 

A more feasible option is to ask to ZWO to add support for the ASI120MM or to make open-source the old library that was working with that model, so that an Android porting can be implemented by the community.

 

I asked many times if they were willing to make open-source their SDK, but never had luck. You may want to try as well, if there is enough request they may reconsider this.

[antarex]

Thank you very much for all the explanations.

So, let's say that the 8-bit frame counter should read neither "0" nor "255". To avoid having the "dark" and "light" areas saturated. Ok, then I understand its usefulness
But in case of RAW16 setting, does the counter always refer to 8 bits?

 

Here are some other possible improvements:

 

1) If I click GALLERY, it only shows me the photo shots in the list, but not the .SER shots. Even if you have decided not to show the SER files, because they are not playable by the smartphone. You could show the name of the video file, so that you can delete it immediately. Without having to exit the app.

 

2) If I click "SAVE RAW", to take a first photo. After that, only "SAVE" appears in the rectangle.

 

3) When shooting video, can you add the duration on the display? If there is no space, you could delete the timetable

 

 

Regarding the ASI 120MM USB 2.0 version, i understand that the matter is complex. I also send an email to ZWO.

It's a shame not to be able to use it with the app, and to be forced to always use it with the PC.

Speaking of using this camera with the PC... I'm having problems! I hope you can help me, even if we're not talking about your app, specifically.

It doesn't work with many USB 3.0 ports, and I connect it correctly to the USB 2.0 ports. But even with USB 2.0 ports, there are problems!
Using Sharpcap and Asicap (pc version) with Windows 10, on two notebooks (USB 2.0 ports) the fps are half of those expected at maximum resolution!
If both the "TURBO USB" and "high speed" options are active, the fps increase until they reach the maximum expected ones. But they fluctuate a lot, until they drop to "0 fps" with max resolution! Dropped frames also increase! It happens at high resolutions with 8 bits of color, and at all resolutions with 16 bits of color. No problems with low resolution frames with 8 bit colors.

Instead, if I connect the camera to a USB 2.0 port on the desktop PC, and activate "TURBO USB" and "high speed". The fps speed reaches the expected maximum and remains stable, without oscillations and rare frame drops. With any resolution and color bit.

What could account for the fact that I have no problems with the desktop PC, and with the two notebooks, I do?

 

With the ZWO tool I verified that the firmware version is 3.0, and the possible updates found on the ZWO website are dated 2013! So, I don't think they are newer than the one already present.

 

ps: I would like to attach some screenshots, but I don't know how to do it on this forum, can you explain it to me? Screenshot from "postimage", it doesn't load them for me, it gives me an error.

 

Thank you

Edited by antarex, 12 March 2024 - 10:32 PM.

[antarex]

Here are the screenshots

Attached Thumbnails

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Edited by antarex, 13 March 2024 - 01:01 AM.