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Eclipse orchestrator handling two identical cameras ?

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#1 Gert

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 03:59 AM

Hello All,

 

 

I've been using Eclipse Orchestrator successfully in several prev. eclipses with Canon EOS T3i. Using the PC version on Windows 10 Pro Laptop. Now for the 2024 eclipse I am developing my script and have added a second EOS T3i. What happens is that Eclipse Orchestrator seems to not be able to distinguish between the two Canons. :-(

 

2xCanon.jpg

 

I had thought / hoped that the numerical sequence in the pulldown was some serial number. But it is the same for both cameras.

Note the cameras list at the bottom. I've called them EOS601D and EOS602D. Eclipse Orchestrator erroneously thinks there are 4 cameras! It shows both cameras 2x as if when it probes for each one from the spec in the setup both answer simultaneously with same ID. Trying the feature to press function keys, supposedly F1 and F2 would trigger EOS601D and F3 and F4 trigger EOS602D. But all 4 function keys trigger EOS601D. The EOS602D remains silent. This is latest non-beta release of Eclipse Orchestrator.

 

Any chance to fix this?

 

Why don't I use another camera? Yes, I also have a T5i but although it is a (somewhat) newer model the cadence of sequential shutter triggers I can achieve with it is slower than with the T3i.

 

Thanks & Clear Skies,
Gert

 

PS is there a dedicated Eclipse Orchestrator forum to discuss/resolve this??

 



#2 chvvkumar

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 09:32 AM

I am using two computers (a mini PC I use for my regular AP and my laptop) to minimize single point of failures for my two imaging trains.



#3 KevinMerchant

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 02:34 PM

Hello All,

 

I've been using Eclipse Orchestrator successfully in several prev. eclipses with Canon EOS T3i. Using the PC version on Windows 10 Pro Laptop. Now for the 2024 eclipse I am developing my script and have added a second EOS T3i. What happens is that Eclipse Orchestrator seems to not be able to distinguish between the two Canons. :-(

 

 

I had thought / hoped that the numerical sequence in the pulldown was some serial number. But it is the same for both cameras.

Note the cameras list at the bottom. I've called them EOS601D and EOS602D. Eclipse Orchestrator erroneously thinks there are 4 cameras! It shows both cameras 2x as if when it probes for each one from the spec in the setup both answer simultaneously with same ID. Trying the feature to press function keys, supposedly F1 and F2 would trigger EOS601D and F3 and F4 trigger EOS602D. But all 4 function keys trigger EOS601D. The EOS602D remains silent. This is latest non-beta release of Eclipse Orchestrator.

 

Any chance to fix this?

 

Why don't I use another camera? Yes, I also have a T5i but although it is a (somewhat) newer model the cadence of sequential shutter triggers I can achieve with it is slower than with the T3i.

 

Thanks & Clear Skies,
Gert

 

PS is there a dedicated Eclipse Orchestrator forum to discuss/resolve this??

Hello Gert,

 

I believe that you are right that the "2147483647" number is supposed to be a camera serial number, just not your cameras. As a matter of fact, this same number shows for me with an R5 and R7 attached (not simultaneously).

 

I also believe that the developer (Fred Brunjes) intends for Eclipse Orchestrator to be able to be used with more than one camera simultaneously.

 

I did a little digging and looked at the config.ini file, which EO uses to store configuration information, using Notepad. Below is for one of my setups.

 

#CamNum,Camera,ShutterCable,ComPort,ComBit,PressMilliseconds,MLUon,Baud,Type,Model,SerialNumber,Aperture,EFL,PoweredCable,InvertedSerial,IRreceive,ShutterType,RecycleTime,Mount
1,R5,Y,COM3,RTS,50,0,300,2,Canon EOS R5,2147483647,14.00,1000.000,0,0,0,2,0.60,1
GPS,,,COM4,,,,,,,
Kestrel,,,,,,,,,,

 

As you can see, there is that familiar 10 digit serial number. I did a test and entered the actual 12 digit R5 serial number in config.ini and restarted EO with the R5 attached. EO popped up a dialog box saying it did not find the camera attached.

 

This kind of tells me there is a possible bug in the software. I don't have any way of knowing if 10 digits vs. 12 digits has anything to do with it. But, guessing from your experience, it has more to do with something else in the software. Perhaps worth reporting directly to Moonglow/Fred Brunjes, but I'm guessing a long shot at getting fixed, especially before April 8th.

 

I'm guessing that you tried attaching the cameras one at a time as opposed to both at once. If not, that might be worth trying.

 

For what it's worth, per a presentation from Fred Brunjes (and Xavier Jubier, developer of Solar Eclipse Maestro) to the Kalamazoo Astronomical Society, neither of them recommends trying to control two cameras with one computer for the eclipse. Just passing along what I directly heard from them.

 

Also, no dedicated support forum.

 

I hope this is of some value.

 

Kevin


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#4 KevinMerchant

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 03:05 PM

Gert -

 

Looking a little closer at the Hardware Configuration dialog, there is an option to assign a number to the camera (1, 2 or 3) right at the top, next to Description. It was not clear if you caught that.

 

Kevin


Edited by KevinMerchant, 21 February 2024 - 03:06 PM.


#5 Daniel Dance

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 04:20 PM

I am using two computers (a mini PC I use for my regular AP and my laptop) to minimize single point of failures for my two imaging trains.

I agree this is the best method for two reasons:

 

1.  EO is not really guaranteed to work reliably with two cameras.  Its a feature, but not one that is really recommended by the developer.  If EO fails in this regard during the shooting, you lose out on two imaging systems.

 

2.  If your computer fails, you're again losing out on both your two imaging systems.

 

 

Now if you have 2 computers running:

 

1.  If one computer fails the "day-of", you still have a backup computer for at least one rig.


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#6 Gert

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 06:58 PM

Hi Kevin,

Thank you for the good analysis.

I have both cameras connected to the laptop via USB, then power up the cameras, then start EO on the laptop. EO launches properly and gets started. I have run t3i + t5i on previous eclipses and many dryruns never with a problem. That being my known-working solution I can always fall back to it. I wanted the t3i + t3i because I expected better exposure cadence from it. The t5i is surprisingly slow with EO. Seems I'll not get to know the outcome of this hypothesis as the t3i + t3i combo just doesn't fly with EO.

Is there a reasonable comm channel to Fred B.?? I tried sending an email but didn't get any response.

Thanks & Clear Skies,
Gert

#7 Gert

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 07:01 PM

Gert -

Looking a little closer at the Hardware Configuration dialog, there is an option to assign a number to the camera (1, 2 or 3) right at the top, next to Description. It was not clear if you caught that.

Kevin


Yes, I have one t3i setup as #1 and the other as #2. I had hoped there was a way for EO to distinguish between the two.

The same #1 #2 setup has worked many times before with t3i + t5i and t3i + xsi.

Thanks & Clear Skies,
Gert

#8 KevinMerchant

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 07:47 PM

Hi Kevin,

Thank you for the good analysis.

I have both cameras connected to the laptop via USB, then power up the cameras, then start EO on the laptop. EO launches properly and gets started. I have run t3i + t5i on previous eclipses and many dryruns never with a problem. That being my known-working solution I can always fall back to it. I wanted the t3i + t3i because I expected better exposure cadence from it. The t5i is surprisingly slow with EO. Seems I'll not get to know the outcome of this hypothesis as the t3i + t3i combo just doesn't fly with EO.

Is there a reasonable comm channel to Fred B.?? I tried sending an email but didn't get any response.

Thanks & Clear Skies,
Gert

So, do you see different serial numbers between the t3i and the t5i? I ask because your screen capture shows exactly the same serial number that I see for my R5, which is not correct.

 

From what I can tell in the config.ini file, the serial number seems to be how the cameras are uniquely identified.

 

Perhaps rolling back to an older version of the software could work. Not ideal, but it could tell you if something has been broken along the way with software updates.

 

As far as e-mailing and getting an answer back, based on what Fred said in a presentation to the Kalamazoo Astronomical Society, EO is not his primary focus and he is very busy running his "other" business.


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#9 CreatorsHand

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 08:35 PM

So, do you see different serial numbers between the t3i and the t5i? I ask because your screen capture shows exactly the same serial number that I see for my R5, which is not correct.

 

From what I can tell in the config.ini file, the serial number seems to be how the cameras are uniquely identified.

 

Perhaps rolling back to an older version of the software could work. Not ideal, but it could tell you if something has been broken along the way with software updates.

 

As far as e-mailing and getting an answer back, based on what Fred said in a presentation to the Kalamazoo Astronomical Society, EO is not his primary focus and he is very busy running his "other" business.

It shows that exact same Serial Number for both my 7DII and 5DIV, also.

 

Paul



#10 Gert

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 11:11 PM

Hi Paul,

It shows that exact same Serial Number for both my 7DII and 5DIV, also.

 

Paul

That totally confused me. So I tried it and strangely with the t3i + t5i again I get the same ID number. So then this means that that number is not a camera internal serial/type number but something else. My assumption it could/should have been something to make EO distinguish the two cameras must have been wrong.

 

EO_2xCanon.jpg

 

 

So that does not then help me in any way to a solution, as now it is only that short text string that is usable to distinguish the cameras. And obviously with the same model camera that becomes useless.

 

I was clicking around in the Canon camera menu if I find something to set the camera 'Name', but that was unsuccessful. At least nothing is exposed via the LCD menu. Anybody knows anything else?

 

Thanks & Clear Skies,

Gert


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#11 CreatorsHand

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Posted 21 February 2024 - 11:41 PM

Hi Paul,

That totally confused me. So I tried it and strangely with the t3i + t5i again I get the same ID number. So then this means that that number is not a camera internal serial/type number but something else. My assumption it could/should have been something to make EO distinguish the two cameras must have been wrong.

 

EO_2xCanon.jpg

 

 

So that does not then help me in any way to a solution, as now it is only that short text string that is usable to distinguish the cameras. And obviously with the same model camera that becomes useless.

 

I was clicking around in the Canon camera menu if I find something to set the camera 'Name', but that was unsuccessful. At least nothing is exposed via the LCD menu. Anybody knows anything else?

 

Thanks & Clear Skies,

Gert

Hi Gert,

 

My guess would be that the developer of EO put that 10 digit number in there when he did the original programming as a place holder, anticipating that he would someday add the capability of reading the Serial Number of the camera, and that never happened. It seems obvious that EO is intended to differentiate between cameras using the description that you put in the hardware configuration, but it appears that in your case at least that falls apart for identical cameras. When you had both T3i cameras connected, did you try triggering both using the drop-down menu under the Cameras tab, or just using the Function keys? I found that the F1 button didn't always trigger the camera even though I only have one camera connected, but the drop-down menu worked consistently. Once I get one camera working, I will likely try two myself, and I do have 2 7DIIs, but I don't know how soon that would be, and I don't want to promise anything. It may be that the best bet is to use the two different cameras and make accommodations for the slower speed of the T5i.. At this point I'm not sure what else to suggest.

 

Paul


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#12 Gert

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Posted 22 February 2024 - 12:40 AM

Hi Paul,

 

Yes, agreed. I have read that Fred B. the EO developer is not able to spend much time on code work, so I guess the user community is stuck with the way the code works just now. Which by the way quite awesome and he deserves huge credit for having pushed this as far as he did. It's just splitting hairs on a really high level, and I don't really complain. I have my fall back model that by now I have tried many times on the bench and it works great. The t3i will get the long focal length scope and will have duty capturing Bailys beads in real time. The t5i will be at ca. 200mm on a more leisurely pace.

 

Thanks & Clear Skies,

Gert


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#13 CreatorsHand

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Posted 22 February 2024 - 04:12 AM

Hi Paul,

 

Yes, agreed. I have read that Fred B. the EO developer is not able to spend much time on code work, so I guess the user community is stuck with the way the code works just now. Which by the way quite awesome and he deserves huge credit for having pushed this as far as he did. It's just splitting hairs on a really high level, and I don't really complain. I have my fall back model that by now I have tried many times on the bench and it works great. The t3i will get the long focal length scope and will have duty capturing Bailys beads in real time. The t5i will be at ca. 200mm on a more leisurely pace.

 

Thanks & Clear Skies,

Gert

Hi Gert,

 

Part of the issues may be because we are all frantically trying to figure out how to photograph a rare event, and most people want it to be easy; if it was easy, it wouldn't mean as much when you succeed. My plan is to have my 5DIV on my A-P Traveler (642mm), my 7DII on my 500mm f/4 (800mm full-frame equiv.), trying to capture the full event and corona with both, and my Ha mod 60D on my 400mm f/5.6 with a 1.4x extender (896 full-frame equiv.) to capture Bailey's Beads and prominences in more detail. The 7DII will be controlled by an intervelometer, unless I get comfortable enough with EO to have confidence in it.

 

Good luck in your final prep, and Clear Skies,

Paul





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