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T Corona Borealis

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#1 stanislas-jean

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Posted 05 May 2024 - 06:08 AM

Hi, 

Don't know where exactly post this topic concerning T Crb, the recurent super nova in the Corona Borealis constellation.

The image was taken with a seestar, very easy to erect and for capturing rough images.

The chipset is the 462C asi and filtering a 400-700nm bandpass filter.

I may use a sloan or a jonhson similar filter but not here.

5min of 10s subs acquisition under a sky sometimes occulted by cyrus clouds and during a strong wind night: we donot choose the time.

Here is (IC4587 was used for targetting the scope).

Matter of improvements indeed.

IC4387: magn 14,3   T Crb around 10,5  the minimal magn star around 14,5.

Good skies.

Stanislas-Jean

 

resized_T corona borealis 04.05.24 5min.jpg


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#2 emflocater

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Posted 05 May 2024 - 07:10 AM

It's not a recurrent supernova but rather a recurrent NOVA.

 

Cheers

Don


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#3 BrooksObs

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Posted 05 May 2024 - 09:18 AM

As Don has indicated, T CrB is simply a recurrent nova, there is no such thing as a recurrent supernova. At the same time, I followed T CrB visually for some 60 years and never saw it fainter than the late 10's in magnitude, so the current brightness of 10.5 is typical of the star being at minmum phase.

 

BrooksObs


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#4 Special Ed

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Posted 05 May 2024 - 04:13 PM

Yes, T CrB, also known as the Blaze Star, is a recurrent nova.  The big news is--it's about to recur.  The outburst happens every 80 years or so and NASA thinks it will blow by September of this year, so it is something to keep an eye on.  They say it will go to mag 2 or 3.

 

View Nova Explosion

 

A friend of mine told me about it back in March--since then the word has been going around.  Like Stanislas-Jean, I made an image of T CrB to have a record of its "normal" appearance.

 

MR T_CrB_resize.jpg


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#5 yuzameh

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Posted 05 May 2024 - 05:25 PM

If the skies deign to be clear on the coupla nights or so it is at maximum and the relevant bit of sky deigns to not be too near Solar Conjunction, then you will see it easily enough with just your eyeballs.

 

Learn to recognise Corona Borealis as an asterism, it's shape, relative mags etc.

 

When T CrB goes bang (unless it decides to be contrary and doesn't bother this time) then you will just need to look towards the constellation and you'll see T CrB an utter and complete doddle for suddenly Diadem (more commonly known as Gemma), that is alpha Coronae Borealis, the jewel in the crown so to speak, is magnitude 2 and the only magnitude two star for some distance, whereas T CrB achieved magnitude 2 during the two certainly and independently observed outbursts, so you'll see a pair of equal brightness stars in the sky not quite 6 degrees apart, which you will never have seen before (the Sun's disc and the full Moon's disc are roughly half a degree wide, as roughly is your raised thumb held at arms length (which can be checked by placing over the Moon next time it is full).

 

The so called NASA prediction is not a NASA prediction but a Schaeffer prediction and he has mistaken the return of the natural sinusoidal variation depicting the orbital period of the lightcurve due to the ellipsoidal (egg shaped) nature of the red giant (due to gravity of the white dwarf causing tidal effects and all that) which has returned after a decade or so long 'high state'.  There was a high state prior to the last explosion, followed by a short dip, then the explosion, but that high state was of far less duration than the recent one and the dip was very short and certainly more pronounced.  Schaeffer just read the data wrong.  Seeing as cataclysmic variables and recurrent novae are his professional speciality this is a bit annoying, but he's a long history of fitting historical data into conclusions despite the thinness of the former.  Don't get me wrong, he has been quite successful at times in this area fo research.  He's also been quite wrong at times too.

 

If the dip he declared had started this time around had really been the dip he claimed for his Feb onwards prediction it would have blown up by now, or would be due within the next six weeks, based on the dip duration of the last outburst.  Now suddenly everyone is saying April to September conveniently forgetting he originally said Feb to Sep.  By June they'll be saying June to September, forgetting they said April.

 

Whatever the case, you keep going until it blows up, eyeball the constellation regularly and take your images, it will fade in just over a week or so, rapidly, and will explode from faint to maximum in barely a day.

 

If you have Burnham's Celestial Handbook, which many observers have even those who could care less about variable stars, there is an entry on it there with a good plot of the lightcurves of the only two certainly known outbursts (one feasible older one has been claimed but with only one observer, no independent observation, whilst another much earlier assumed outburst is based on fresh air evidence that isn't even good in itself, let alone unconfirmed).  That will clue you into what is likely to happen.  The last two outbursts were very similar, though with some subtle differences towards the end, and the first lightcurve has little or no prior to outburst data because that outburst was the discovery one so no-one was bothering to look.  In fact, very few people bothered to look after that, it was just by coincidence that Leslie Peltier included some old novae as exploding variable star targets because their nature wasn't clear in those days, and thus there is data before the outburst.  Until the 1945/46 event no one knew it was a so called recurrent nova.

 

In fact only T CrB and RS Oph (which I saw in its most recent explosion a year or two ago, but it only gets to mag 4, but every 6 to 12 years instead of 80) are long studied and firmly established recurrent novae where the other star is a red giant.  The other ones known, such as U Sco and T Pyx, have dwarf star companions.  There's a longer list nowadays of objects, some even been found to outburst three times, but the other outbursts are often found in archival data and not many of those have been caught in outburst in recent times (if any, but I haven't checked recently).

 

So, yes do keep looking, no don't stop in September, dates are GUESSTIMATES, and yes do keep going even if it takes you into late 2026.  Mostly because 80 years is 80 years, and although Halley's comet was rubbish last time I saw it, just, but I won't be around for the likely much better next return.

 

T CrB last blew up before I was born.  If it is a regular 80 year thing it will next blow up around 2105 or 2106 when I'll be long dead (as indeed so may the planet).

 

I first heard about it in the 1970s, I never expected to get to this date and a chance of seeing it even though I'm not that old, you don't think about that when you are younger.  However, if it DOES blow up this year I reckon, given the year so far, that I will be full clouded out during the whole thing.  So be prepared but don't put too much expectation into it, just in case of the universe being a so and so.


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#6 stanislas-jean

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Posted 06 May 2024 - 06:00 AM

The question of T Crb is it is not functionning as a swiss clock for sure.

Some predicted an occurence during feb-march, now some others for september.

Well, nobody knows in fact and in order to pick-up the burst as it seems sure to appear during a one-two days period, the survey should be undertaken with a shot each 2 days maximum.

With the number of observers around this planet this should be with an alert communicated to each observer if a burst is occuring.

As it is done for the planet Mars survey....

Good skies.

Stanislas-Jean


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#7 deepskysailor

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Posted 06 May 2024 - 05:13 PM

It's better to post this thread in the Scientific Amateur Astronomy forum, where many talk about photometry and variable stars.


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#8 Redbetter

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Posted 06 May 2024 - 07:18 PM

It's better to post this thread in the Scientific Amateur Astronomy forum, where many talk about photometry and variable stars.

Not in this case.  This also a visual observing, deep sky topic, for what will be a somewhat unique event whenever it happens.  For those reasons it is also of general interest to deep sky observers.

 

Variable star alerts are not unwelcome here, and it would be a pity if there wasn't some back and forth with the imaging spectra and photometry aspects that are in the other forum.  

 

I can't speak for others here, but I don't want this to end up like comets that have been stripped from the Solar System Observing forum because of the imaging aspect.  


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#9 stanislas-jean

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Posted 07 May 2024 - 06:23 AM

Frankly we can cut topics for a reason or others.

From my opinion, even not entering in the astrophysical theories about this kind of phenomena, some conditions needs to be taken into account: capturing by imaging and the parameters also in order to approach the right actual magnitude of the nova on the instant.

Personnally, what I see:

- impact of the used chipset (here a 462 color)

- filtering (here a 400-700nm bandpas filter)

- sky conditions, transparency and star elevation, seeing (here for the least 3")

- star catalog to be suitable with the filters in use.

We have lot of star catalogs, planetarium software that give physical caractéristics but against which references...

Do we roughly go to specialised filters (sloan, jonhson,...)?

I am convinced that the magnitude read on the picture is false, for the reason of the influence of the parameters listed above.

Good skies.

Stanislas-Jean



#10 Sebastian_Sajaroff

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Posted 08 May 2024 - 06:51 AM

I observed it 2 days ago on my 70 mm F/6 refractor at 35x. It’s still at ~mag 10.5
Note that it’s very easy to point to T CrB.
Start with Alphecca (α CrB), move to ε CrB and then 2° south-east.
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#11 Krish123

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Posted 08 May 2024 - 10:21 AM

I might sound dumb here but is 24 Comae burnicies the same as TCrB?


Edited by Krish123, 08 May 2024 - 10:21 AM.


#12 Dave Mitsky

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Posted 08 May 2024 - 11:12 AM

I might sound dumb here but is 24 Comae burnicies the same as TCrB?

No, TCrB is short for T Coronae Borealis.
 

https://www.astronom...the-generation/
 

https://www.go-astro...Corona Borealis


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#13 stanislas-jean

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Posted 10 May 2024 - 05:44 AM

Hi,

here is a shot (6min) of T Crb area under good conditions, no wind and relative transparent sky, no cyrus clouds.

 

This will be my refrence shot for further evenings.

 

resized_T Crb 08.05.25  6min.jpg

 

Good skies.

Stanislas-Jean


Edited by stanislas-jean, 10 May 2024 - 05:49 AM.

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#14 stanislas-jean

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Posted 25 May 2024 - 07:20 AM

Hi,

When the sky is acceptable, I shoot T Crb, until the 23rd may, it stays usual.

Here are the last captures:

 

on 16th may with the SS50: 3min exposure

 

resized_T Crb 16.05.24 3min.jpg

 

on the 23rd: 3 min exposure

 

resized_T Crb 23.05.24 3min.jpg

 

Sky good, windy and strong seeing >3".

 

We will see.

Good skies.

Stanislas-Jean

 

 

 

 

 

 


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#15 Achernar

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Posted 27 May 2024 - 05:30 PM

I took this image on the night of May 19th of the area where T Coronae Borealis is. The bright star at the bottom of the image is Epsilon Coronae Borealis. T Coronae Borealis is the red star marked by white tick marks. I checked the photo against an AAVSO finder chart. The image was stacked from 90 one-minute sub frames taken through red, green and blue filters. The weather has been lousy in Coastal Alabama, but I will be watching at every opportunity for the coming outburst.

 

Taras

Attached Thumbnails

  • T Corona Borealis_RGB_05-19-2024_location_small.jpg

Edited by Achernar, 27 May 2024 - 05:43 PM.

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#16 stanislas-jean

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Posted 28 May 2024 - 05:54 AM

Here is a picture of the 27th captures with the SS50.

 

resized_T Crb 27.05.24.jpg

 

It seems less bright, a little than previous captures.

Good skies.

Stanislas-Jean


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#17 stanislas-jean

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Posted 31 May 2024 - 06:21 AM

Hi,

Here is the capture of the 30th may, still on its low status.

This can be at anytime now.

Good skies
Stanislas-Jean

 

resized_T Crb 30.05.24 3min.jpg


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#18 stanislas-jean

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Posted 16 June 2024 - 05:10 AM

HI,

A shot of T Crb of last 15th evening.

Still stable.

2min of 4s subs with the evscope.

Good sky transparency with moonlight, elevation 75°.

 

resized_T Crb 2min 15.06.24.jpg

 

Good skies

Stanislas-Jean


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#19 emflocater

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Posted 19 June 2024 - 09:27 AM

HI,

A shot of T Crb of last 15th evening.

Still stable.

2min of 4s subs with the evscope.

Good sky transparency with moonlight, elevation 75°.

 

attachicon.gif resized_T Crb 2min 15.06.24.jpg

 

Good skies

Stanislas-Jean

Great pics. Could you circle in red the T Crb in any future pics to make it easier for Folks  to pinpoint its location.

 

Thanks

Don



#20 NGC 2419

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Posted 20 June 2024 - 08:19 PM

Does anyone know of a service that will send you an email or text when this erupts? I don't want to sign up for any type of general astronomy alerts that will flood my inbox, I just want an alert when this nova occurs.

Thanks!

#21 yuzameh

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Posted 20 June 2024 - 08:55 PM

Nope, professionally there'd be billions of accounts for every single object if astronomy worked that way.

 

It ain't THAT special.  There's been advice in threads of online telegrams you can stare at without feeds daily when you're playing with your smartphone or just on the 'net.  Also, just look up when it is clear, an alert coming in whilst you are in bed asleep during a thunderstorm over a wet weekend won't make any difference anyway.



#22 NGC 2419

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Posted 20 June 2024 - 09:35 PM

Nope, professionally there'd be billions of accounts for every single object if astronomy worked that way.

It ain't THAT special. There's been advice in threads of online telegrams you can stare at without feeds daily when you're playing with your smartphone or just on the 'net. Also, just look up when it is clear, an alert coming in whilst you are in bed asleep during a thunderstorm over a wet weekend won't make any difference anyway.


It may not be THAT special to you, but having never seen a nova, I'd like to be notified when it finally brightens even if I'm in bed asleep during a thunderstorm over a wet weekend.

For anyone else that might be interested, I found a "time sensitive alerts" thread for T CrB at the AAVSO that you can subscribe to for updates here.

https://www.aavso.or...ts-forum-thread

The AAVSO also has something called MyNewsFlash that looks like it can be customized to send alerts about a particular outburst too, but I haven't tried setting it up yet.

Clear skies!

#23 stanislas-jean

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Posted 21 June 2024 - 04:50 AM

Does anyone know of a service that will send you an email or text when this erupts? I don't want to sign up for any type of general astronomy alerts that will flood my inbox, I just want an alert when this nova occurs.

Thanks!

Hi,

Rather than get an email for getting the event on going, when possible make a shot of T Crb under an open sky even not excellent.

And check frequently the AAVSO website for any occurence.

 

On the last picture above performed with the evscope unistellar, the T Crb is centered and you may see systems of 3 double stars as reference, this create a tringle where T Crb is in. The field of view is tiny but a ss50 zwo can image also with a greater FOV having stars for to-day of similar magnitudes. This is easy.

The presence of IC 4587 close to can help you also for finding the celestial north.

 

Here is a picture performed last 18th with the SS50, only 3rd magn stars was visible visually during the shot.

Good skies.

Stanislas-Jean

 

resized_T Crb 2min 18.06.24.jpg


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#24 NGC 2419

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Posted 21 June 2024 - 10:27 AM

Hi,
Rather than get an email for getting the event on going, when possible make a shot of T Crb under an open sky even not excellent.
And check frequently the AAVSO website for any occurence.

On the last picture above performed with the evscope unistellar, the T Crb is centered and you may see systems of 3 double stars as reference, this create a tringle where T Crb is in. The field of view is tiny but a ss50 zwo can image also with a greater FOV having stars for to-day of similar magnitudes. This is easy.
The presence of IC 4587 close to can help you also for finding the celestial north.

Here is a picture performed last 18th with the SS50, only 3rd magn stars was visible visually during the shot.
Good skies.
Stanislas-Jean

resized_T Crb 2min 18.06.24.jpg


So your suggestion for receiving a notification when it brightens is to go out and image it myself? SMH.

Thanks, but I found a workable solution.

#25 yuzameh

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Posted 21 June 2024 - 12:32 PM

It may not be THAT special to you, but having never seen a nova, I'd like to be notified when it finally brightens even if I'm in bed asleep during a thunderstorm over a wet weekend.

 

I was talking in the context of "official" pro alert systems.  It is of course special but NOT uniquely special, many alert systems will declare it when it happens, but not UNIQUELY

 

Yes, AAVSO has a selective option in some areas but it does not mean they will be first to notice it or if out of office hours whether their webpages will be updated before the next day.

 

Of course that won't stop it being posted in by members, but then you have to wait for independent confirmation.

 

As for alerts when you've no chance of observing it, well what's the point?  Cloudynights will be riddled with posts and images and links people have gleaned from several services, as will online archives of aavso discussion fora, baavss-alert at io groups, also cvnet obs there, astronomerstelegram.org, IAUC CBAT cbets, all of which can be looked at or if temporarily subscribed to readily unregistered from.  Don't bother with vsnet, if you subscribe to that you'll probably never get to subscribe and you would be drowned in emails anyway, although again they have online archive of their posts but again you'll have stuff to wade through.

 

It's not special enough to be uniquely alerted because multiple systems exist for alerting.

 

Munari et al will post details of the spectra they have taken to astronomerstelegram.org as soon as the thing belches, and then you'll know it has.

 

We'd all like to see it of course, but that depends on the skies, just look up, if it's night, clear and it's mag 3 or so you may see it before you even get the alert.  It'll be short and it may possibly not be as sweet as some may have already imagined it to be.  You'll have a few days to see it unaided by equipment, so if you haven't looked at it currently once then you'll have nothing in your memory to compare it against if you can't get to look at it until it's back down to mag 7.

 

Or you may be lucky.




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