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seeking further assistance with upgrade from .965 to 1.25 eyepiece

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#1 Overtime

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Posted 23 May 2024 - 11:16 AM

It is becoming apparent this is going to be a PITA upgrade that could be solved by me just getting a scope with a 1.25 eyepiece. Since I am more of a novice and it isn't a simple upgrade to my current scope I have made the decision at least for to hold off on this upgrade.  I am posting photos in case it may help someone else in the future since my rig seems to be an oddball/relic.

https://photos.app.g...JAetJFDwM2tRtR8

https://photos.app.g...6CVqs53cpkDkZr5

 

 


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#2 JohnnyBGood

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Posted 23 May 2024 - 11:27 AM

An easier solution might be to replace the whole focuser assembly using parts from a newer telescope. Those 114 mm reflectors are pretty common and usually not very expensive used, especially if they're missing eyepieces or have broken tripods or some other problem that doesn't affect the focuser. If the tube diameter isn't exactly the same you might be able to make a foam shim to go between then focuser and the telescope tube.


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#3 Overtime

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Posted 23 May 2024 - 11:54 AM

An easier solution might be to replace the whole focuser assembly using parts from a newer telescope. Those 114 mm reflectors are pretty common and usually not very expensive used, especially if they're missing eyepieces or have broken tripods or some other problem that doesn't affect the focuser. If the tube diameter isn't exactly the same you might be able to make a foam shim to go between then focuser and the telescope tube.

I had thought about that. I am good at making things work with pars that weren't designed to work with them, but there are so many possible issues that can pop up if I would go that route. I have seen scopes similar to this on sale on marketplace and craigs list very cheap. That's  one of the reasons I have decided to abandon this project at least for now. Who knows what till happen in the future? Maybe Marty or Doc Brown can tell me. lol


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#4 sevenofnine

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Posted 23 May 2024 - 12:34 PM

If the scope cleans up fine and the view through the eyepiece is decent then shop the Eyepiece section in C/N Classifieds. This ad came up today. Good luck! borg.gif

 

https://www.cloudyni...yepiecesfilter/.


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#5 Anony

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Posted 23 May 2024 - 01:35 PM

An easier solution might be to replace the whole focuser assembly using parts from a newer telescope. Those 114 mm reflectors are pretty common and usually not very expensive used, especially if they're missing eyepieces or have broken tripods or some other problem that doesn't affect the focuser. If the tube diameter isn't exactly the same you might be able to make a foam shim to go between then focuser and the telescope tube.

I think the real issue is that an entire new 114mm is cheap, as you mentioned, and quite often have all the parts and work fine. Or fine as they can on rather iffy mounts (similar to what the OP has).

 

When looking over his FB marketplace, I saw a very similar scope as his, with 1.25, for $50. And I expect one can always try for less.

 

On my FB marketplace, $50 or so seems to be about what they go for too.

 

Might as well just go with the replacement scope vs ripping out the focuser to use in his current scope.


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#6 JohnnyBGood

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Posted 24 May 2024 - 08:34 AM

I think the real issue is that an entire new 114mm is cheap, as you mentioned, and quite often have all the parts and work fine. Or fine as they can on rather iffy mounts (similar to what the OP has).

 

When looking over his FB marketplace, I saw a very similar scope as his, with 1.25, for $50. And I expect one can always try for less.

 

On my FB marketplace, $50 or so seems to be about what they go for too.

 

Might as well just go with the replacement scope vs ripping out the focuser to use in his current scope.

 

I agree, it's almost always more economical to buy something modern than it is to fix something old but sometimes the old things have sentimental value or it's just fun to see how much better you can make something. I replaced the focuser on my old 60mm Tasco to be able to use 1.25" eyepieces. Had to shorten the tube to get it to focus properly. Then I blackened the inside, replaced the tripod legs and spreader, added tube rings, replaced the 5x24 finder with a 6x30, etc. That's all way more than the scope is worth (I bought it for $20 used in the first place) but it was a fun project and I enjoy using it.


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#7 Anony

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Posted 24 May 2024 - 10:02 AM

I agree, it's almost always more economical to buy something modern than it is to fix something old but sometimes the old things have sentimental value or it's just fun to see how much better you can make something. I replaced the focuser on my old 60mm Tasco to be able to use 1.25" eyepieces. Had to shorten the tube to get it to focus properly. Then I blackened the inside, replaced the tripod legs and spreader, added tube rings, replaced the 5x24 finder with a 6x30, etc. That's all way more than the scope is worth (I bought it for $20 used in the first place) but it was a fun project and I enjoy using it.

Yeah, I understand the idea of fixing up something older. I have an older 60mm classic and have an 1.25" eyepiece adapter for it, although I'd probably get better results just buying a modern 60mm.

 

Or using one of my other zillion better scopes. But I still like to use it once in a rare while. No sentimental value, I just think the thing looks kind of cool.

 

But that only cost me <$5 for the adapter. So probably a bad example...

 

Not sure if the scope has any sentimental value to the OP... could be fun to make use of once in a while, but as one's main scope, probably better to just get something else. 



#8 dmgriff

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Posted 24 May 2024 - 10:44 AM

It is becoming apparent this is going to be a PITA upgrade that could be solved by me just getting a scope with a 1.25 eyepiece. Since I am more of a novice and it isn't a simple upgrade to my current scope I have made the decision at least for to hold off on this upgrade.  I am posting photos in case it may help someone else in the future since my rig seems to be an oddball/relic.

https://photos.app.g...JAetJFDwM2tRtR8

https://photos.app.g...6CVqs53cpkDkZr5

Is the scope made in Japan? Is the focuser metal? Wooden legs on tripod?

 

If yes and the mirror is clean it is better mechanically and probably optically than many current 114/900. 

 

Does the current eyepiece give you a clean view? As mentioned .965 eyepieces are available used. Kellner's and Plossls and I believe Erfles etc. are available. OPT (now Agena Astro) offered new Antares 17mm, 7.5mm .965, call Agena Astro if interested. The Surplus Shed makes .965 formats from surplus optics at modest prices.

https://optcorp.com/...0-965-eyepieces

 

Harry Siebert, Siebert Optics (USA) manufactures .965 eyepieces and barlows (they are not inexpensive) mostly targeted at the Unitron crowd I imagine.

 

For a very modest investment the scope should be fully functional.

 

Good viewing,

 

Dave


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#9 Overtime

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Posted 24 May 2024 - 11:12 AM

I agree, it's almost always more economical to buy something modern than it is to fix something old but sometimes the old things have sentimental value or it's just fun to see how much better you can make something. I replaced the focuser on my old 60mm Tasco to be able to use 1.25" eyepieces. Had to shorten the tube to get it to focus properly. Then I blackened the inside, replaced the tripod legs and spreader, added tube rings, replaced the 5x24 finder with a 6x30, etc. That's all way more than the scope is worth (I bought it for $20 used in the first place) but it was a fun project and I enjoy using it.

I was gifted this scope after the seller ( ex-coworker ) suggested I pick it up instead  of shipping. He realized he wanted to get rid of it more then the money and I was going to save him the trouble of shipping it.

I plan to mark the legs on my scope ( sorta like a ruler ) to get it level easier. I actually thought I could cut my focuser and make it shorter but if it didn't work i would be screwed. Perhaps someday I will get a donor scope so I can swap/modify parts. I wish I had some of the tools I had access to then I was in High school.


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#10 Overtime

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Posted 24 May 2024 - 11:29 AM

An easier solution might be to replace the whole focuser assembly using parts from a newer telescope. Those 114 mm reflectors are pretty common and usually not very expensive used, especially if they're missing eyepieces or have broken tripods or some other problem that doesn't affect the focuser. If the tube diameter isn't exactly the same you might be able to make a foam shim to go between then focuser and the telescope tube.

Shimming the focuser is easy, shortening it might be harder.  



#11 therealdmt

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Posted 24 May 2024 - 12:59 PM

Just a thought, but if you have a little money (less than $200 used) and want a bit of a project, a used Heritage 130p (also sold as the AWB OneSky) could be both something you could simply use right away as well as something you could optimize in various ways over time (there’s a giant thread on them here in the Beginner’s forum that can be found with a search, ‘OneSky Newtonian - Astronomers without borders’)



#12 Sky Muse

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Posted 24 May 2024 - 02:59 PM

I have this modern interpretation of your classic Jason kit...

 

kit4c.jpg

 

..a Meade 114/900.  The mount of your kit is manufactured better than my newer one, most likely.

 

In order to modernise your present kit, you can, simply by replacing the focusser; for example...

 

https://www.amazon.c...d_source=1&th=1

 

Also, perhaps the secondary-mirror, if the use of a 1.25" 32mm Plossl is desired.  I'd love to find that out for myself.  

 

Then, the addition of a 80mm medium-"fast" achromat might make for a good pairing with the Newtonian; for example...

 

https://www.highpoin...HRoCo0MQAvD_BwE


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#13 Echolight

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Posted 24 May 2024 - 03:37 PM

Is the scope made in Japan? Is the focuser metal? Wooden legs on tripod?

 

If yes and the mirror is clean it is better mechanically and probably optically than many current 114/900. 

 

Does the current eyepiece give you a clean view? As mentioned .965 eyepieces are available used. Kellner's and Plossls and I believe Erfles etc. are available. OPT (now Agena Astro) offered new Antares 17mm, 7.5mm .965, call Agena Astro if interested. The Surplus Shed makes .965 formats from surplus optics at modest prices.

https://optcorp.com/...0-965-eyepieces

 

Harry Siebert, Siebert Optics (USA) manufactures .965 eyepieces and barlows (they are not inexpensive) mostly targeted at the Unitron crowd I imagine.

 

For a very modest investment the scope should be fully functional.

 

Good viewing,

 

Dave

The biggest problem with .965 eyepieces in a 900mm focal length scope is that it has a maximum true field of view of around 1.3 degrees. About the same as a 1250mm focal length 90mm Mak with 1.25 inch eyepieces.

 

For me, and surely most rookies, and probably even a few much more experienced viewers, that's a bit tight for ease of use on a manual mount. Not to mention you can't fit M44 or M45, or just big areas of the sky in general. I mean if you just want to scan around and see what you can find.

 

I almost always try to guide people to scopes with a reasonably wide field of view to start.

 


Edited by Echolight, 24 May 2024 - 03:42 PM.

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#14 dmgriff

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Posted 24 May 2024 - 09:38 PM

The biggest problem with .965 eyepieces in a 900mm focal length scope is that it has a maximum true field of view of around 1.3 degrees. About the same as a 1250mm focal length 90mm Mak with 1.25 inch eyepieces.

 

For me, and surely most rookies, and probably even a few much more experienced viewers, that's a bit tight for ease of use on a manual mount. Not to mention you can't fit M44 or M45, or just big areas of the sky in general. I mean if you just want to scan around and see what you can find.

 

I almost always try to guide people to scopes with a reasonably wide field of view to start.

That is the scope he has, for free. Apparently the scope is not going to easily convert to 1.25in format. The OP could purchase some cheap 20mm and 10mm 1.25in plossls off Amazon that could be easily returned to check the adapter. The OP has 20mm .965 I believe. A 10mm, 9mm or 7.5mm .965 ep for a very modest investment would have the scope in use. The mount will manually track in the RA axis which will help with the narrow field.


Edited by dmgriff, 24 May 2024 - 09:51 PM.

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#15 Anony

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Posted 25 May 2024 - 10:00 AM

Just a thought, but if you have a little money (less than $200 used) and want a bit of a project, a used Heritage 130p (also sold as the AWB OneSky) could be both something you could simply use right away as well as something you could optimize in various ways over time (there’s a giant thread on them here in the Beginner’s forum that can be found with a search, ‘OneSky Newtonian - Astronomers without borders’)

Agree, although it's only $250 brand new, so if the OP finds one used, look for like half-cost.

 

His area also has decent used scopes show up....  just glanced now and see...

 

 

An Orion 4.5" dob (the one Ed Ting likes) for $150... could offer $100. Or even start at a $75 offer.

 

An Omni 102 at $100, missing some accessories (offer like $50-65).



#16 Oldfracguy

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Posted 26 May 2024 - 03:12 PM

It is becoming apparent this is going to be a PITA upgrade that could be solved by me just getting a scope with a 1.25 eyepiece. Since I am more of a novice and it isn't a simple upgrade to my current scope I have made the decision at least for to hold off on this upgrade.  I am posting photos in case it may help someone else in the future since my rig seems to be an oddball/relic.

https://photos.app.g...JAetJFDwM2tRtR8

https://photos.app.g...6CVqs53cpkDkZr5

If the female threads on the end of your drawtube are M36.4 threads, you can screw in an adaptor:

 

https://agenaastro.c...03-1508039.html

 

and use this 1.25" eyepiece holder/micro-focuser screwed onto the above adaptor:

 

https://agenaastro.c...crofocuser.html

 

Alternatively, you can just use a 0.965"-to-1.25" eyepiece converter:

 

https://www.scopestuff.com/ss_v965.htm

 

The only problem I can foresee depends on how far out you have to rack the focuser to reach focus with your normal 0.965" eyepieces.  These adaptors add length to the focuser, so if you barely have to rack out the focuser with your 0.965" eyepieces to reach focus, then these adaptors will very likely not work.  You won't be able to rack the focuser in far enough to compensate for the added external length.  You can determine whether or not these will work by comparing how much added length these adaptors will add to where the focuser is with your 0.965" eyepieces in focus.  If the focuser is racked out past a certain minimum diatance, then you have that much extra room to not have to rack it out with either of these adaptors installed. 


Edited by Oldfracguy, 26 May 2024 - 03:20 PM.


#17 Paul Sweeney

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Posted 26 May 2024 - 04:37 PM

Go over to the Classics forum. There is a thread called " Ask Away" where you can ask if anyone has a 1.25" focuser lying around.

Also contact your local club for first hand help. If you can't get a new focuser, they can help you move the primary up the tube so that you can use the adapter.

#18 Overtime

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Posted 26 May 2024 - 06:17 PM

Is the scope made in Japan? Is the focuser metal? Wooden legs on tripod?

 

If yes and the mirror is clean it is better mechanically and probably optically than many current 114/900. 

 

Does the current eyepiece give you a clean view? As mentioned .965 eyepieces are available used. Kellner's and Plossls and I believe Erfles etc. are available. OPT (now Agena Astro) offered new Antares 17mm, 7.5mm .965, call Agena Astro if interested. The Surplus Shed makes .965 formats from surplus optics at modest prices.

https://optcorp.com/...0-965-eyepieces

 

Harry Siebert, Siebert Optics (USA) manufactures .965 eyepieces and barlows (they are not inexpensive) mostly targeted at the Unitron crowd I imagine.

 

For a very modest investment the scope should be fully functional.

 

Good viewing,

 

Dave

Yes it was made in Japan, yes the tripod has wooden legs. I dunno about the focuser a magnet won't stick to it but I don't think it's plastic. Mirrors are very clean, I just had the main out to clean it. The .965 gives me a good image. Crisp and clean no caffeine. lol. I bought a 1.25 adaptor hoping it would allow me to use a bigger eyepiece but I can't bring things into focus before the focuser bottoms out. I reread the adaptor info and it says it was for accessories. I am wondering if I use the adaptor then add a short 1.25 barlow if that might work? I might have to try it and find out. 


Edited by Overtime, 26 May 2024 - 06:42 PM.


#19 SporadicGazer

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Posted 26 May 2024 - 07:56 PM

  ... I am wondering if I use the adaptor then add a short 1.25 barlow if that might work? ...

Since the adapter and a 1-1/4" EP won't focus it's pretty unlikely the adapter plus 1-1/4" barlow would.

 

As I suggested in your other thread, a 0.965" barlow and then the adapter might work.  (Not guaranteed.  Might.)



#20 Overtime

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Posted 26 May 2024 - 08:30 PM

Since the adapter and a 1-1/4" EP won't focus it's pretty unlikely the adapter plus 1-1/4" barlow would.

 

As I suggested in your other thread, a 0.965" barlow and then the adapter might work.  (Not guaranteed.  Might.)

This makes me think I am understanding things a bit more and my ideas might not be totally crazy.


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#21 star acres

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Posted 26 May 2024 - 09:44 PM

I'm wondering how good are your mirrors, especially the primary? What is the name and model of this telescope? Certain Celestron C90's have .965 eyepieces, and you might be able to find decent ones that were made Vs the common painful ones. I'd put a question in the eyepieces column and a request as in C N classifieds if you've been joined long enough. If not, that day will come shortly.

#22 Overtime

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Posted 26 May 2024 - 10:10 PM

I'm wondering how good are your mirrors, especially the primary? What is the name and model of this telescope? Certain Celestron C90's have .965 eyepieces, and you might be able to find decent ones that were made Vs the common painful ones. I'd put a question in the eyepieces column and a request as in C N classifieds if you've been joined long enough. If not, that day will come shortly.

Primary is in very good condition, Jason Observatory 4.5 900mm ( listed in my signature ) I have 2 eyepieces a 12mm and 20mm. I have 2 others on order but the shipping on them is slow, fortunately they were not real expensive. the 12mm was a gift from  SporaticGazer. I just got a new finder scope to replace the old one. I haven't had good enough weather to try it out yet other then trying to align it which I used a street sign down the block.



#23 Overtime

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Posted 26 May 2024 - 11:14 PM

Got somewhat of a brake. The clouds are braking up. Unfortunately by the time I move from the finder scope to the main clouds cover my target I don't see the moon yet either. That and the finder is a pain to align. I might just do it my way but not tonight. The new scopes don't seem to adjust as easy probably because they do not have adjusters at the front end. I might change that.




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