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Couldn't sleep - so Saturn 5-29-24 ... and a story

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#1 Mike Spooner

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 10:19 AM

First images in a couple of months (besides the eclipse). Woke up early for some reason. I've been working on a new/rebuild project of replacing a 12.5" f/4.5 with a 14.25" f/3.56 which needed a new upper cage build. I didn't know how well the mirror would work as I had originally figured it for a friend for prime focus wide field photography and he wasn't interested in ultimate quality so I did my best to get it passable. Sadly he passed away before ever using it and it came back to me so I decided to do a tribute scope in his honor. Just got it operational last week and it's nice on deepsky but I didn't really expect much for planetary. 

 

I wasn't planning to even try it at this time but waking early the thought of Saturn season nagged enough to spur me into motion since the scope was already set up in the backyard. I collimated a few nights ago so just ran with it. Also didn't use the Paracorr or ADC as daylight was advancing but it seemed okay with the 5X Powermate and ZWO 224MC camera. It was on the platform so I was able to get some 1-2 minute captures. I worked up two of the better clips. It appears the images apparently included a Titan transit so plus one for "lucky imaging"!

 

Actually not unhappy with the results considering I seem to have forgotten how to process.

 

Comments welcome (if they don't cut too deepwink.gif).

 

Mike Spooner

 

This is UTC 11:50 May 29, 2024 ... 25% of approx 10k frames at capture and 70% resize.

 

04_50_41_lapl6_ap47R6_25_5-29-24Fourteen5xAsImIrf.png 04_50_41_lapl6_ap47R6_25_5-29-24Fourteen5xAsImIrfResize.png

 

This is at UTC 12:05 as above.

 

05_05_42_lapl6_ap36R6_25_5-29-24Fourteen5xAsImIrf.png 05_05_42_lapl6_ap36R6_25_5-29-24Fourteen5xAsImIrfResize.png
 

 


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#2 Astrojensen

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 10:48 AM

A Titan transit... Envious is too weak a word to describe my feelings. 

 

 

Clear skies!

Thomas, Denmark


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#3 KiwiRay

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 11:06 AM

Great job snagging the Titan transit! It was only the second of six this year. It's good to see that it's not hard to capture even in less-than-ideal conditions. Where are you located? Saturn is still too low for me in Seattle before sunrise.


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#4 MisterDan

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 11:15 AM

Titan shadow and "disk" near limb.

Dang, Mike!

waytogo.gif

 

In my opinion, that transit apparition makes for a nice tribute. like-button.jpg

 

Best wishes and thanks for sharing.

Dan


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#5 Mike Spooner

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 11:27 AM

Well, I’m in central Arizona (along with 100+ F daytime temps) and fairly stable air. 
 

Not sure but I think the dark spot is actually Titan and I have a sharpening artifact near the left edge (if my planetarium program is accurate time wise - it has had errors before).

Mike


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#6 Lookitup

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 11:34 AM

I had pretty much the same view a few nights ago with the SM 125ED. Can't wait for Jupiter to be back.



#7 dcaponeii

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 11:55 AM

Great job. Clouded out here so will try on the 14th!!

#8 KiwiRay

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 11:59 AM

Titan shadow and "disk" near limb.

Dang, Mike!

waytogo.gif

 

Just the moon near the middle, no shadow, which falls below the planet right now.


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#9 KiwiRay

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 12:01 PM

Well, I’m in central Arizona (along with 100+ F daytime temps) and fairly stable air. 
 

I was thinking either California or Arizona, which are far enough south so that Saturn is at a decent elevation before sunrise. The next Titan transit on June 14 is a longer one and more of us should have a chance to capture part of it.
 



#10 yuzameh

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 12:47 PM

 

Not sure but I think the dark spot is actually Titan and I have a sharpening artifact near the left edge (if my planetarium program is accurate time wise - it has had errors before).

Mike

You are quite correct, Sirrah!  Thanks to you kindly including date and time I can it was nigh on dead centre 11:50 UT (near my local noon).  At least that's what winjupos reckons, and also Guide 9.0.  The shadow transits don't seem to be happening yet, but from the look of it if you can detect thet delta mag twixt Titan and Saturn, which aren't massively different in colour hue, then once the eclipses start you will be extra truly impressing us!

 

I haven't allowed for our difference in long and lat (all my stuff of course defaults to my long and lat) and just decided it was negligible in this case, after all there won't be much Tital-Saturn parallax due to proximity of both to themselves, sort of thing (warning : my jargon can be wrong as well as illusionary).

 

If you go here https://ssp.imcce.fr...tellites-events then take the drop down for systeme planetaire (should be self evident), then take Saturne, keep epoque as current date (when predicting ahead in time) and set your days ahead accordingly (nombre de dates), you will note the maximum is 365 dates, ie one of the years, then for the loo observation site bung in 500 which is the MPC code for 'geocentric'.  If you got to the Minor Planet Center and dig around you'll find a list of their station codes somewhere so you can pick an observatory nearest you (even easier if you so happen to have one of said yourself!).

 

Then press the calculer button (I wonder what that means) and you'll get the Phenomenes listed underneath.  Fortunately la francais ain't much different here from the Ingerlander tongue so it should be more or less.  The table appears on the same page underneath so you'll have to scroll down a bit (at least that's what happened on my browser), click on the little cogwheel next to the button with the word exporter on it and you'll get a key that's plain enough.  I'm guessing ombre means umbra means shadow, and I guess passage means the transit of the satellite upon Saturn's disc, after all they aren't the same except at near opposition = superior conjunction of Saturn.  Looks like the mutual events are in there too, ie satellite on satellite action, plus fraction of moon eclipsed etc, however I dunno what units D® are in, whether Saturnian radii or whatever, the event duration and what appears to be the arcsecond offset from centre at time of event already have columns, so someone Francais proficient will have to check out the documentation, it has a diagram that may help.  D® is apparently the distance of the satellite to the planets rim reported in planetary radii at the instant of maximum event.

 

Remember EXPORTER, you can save the table.

 

I think they run observing schemes too (there are reports there like PHEM15 and PHEM21, probably more to do with Galilean Satellite mutual phenomena) so I suppose could have a play with that, although timing is a tight thing in asronomy, especially if good astrometry is needed too, which might spoil all da fun.

 

For example for today, amongst others, we get this

 

2024-05-29T09:47:21.319 26.88 606 PA.D   0 -0.06 7.94
2024-05-29T13:25:45.659 27.12 606 PA.F   0 -0.07 7.89

 

Passage "debut", PA.D,  at 09:47:21 UT, Passage probably "finale" at 13:25:46 UT, the object is 606 (sixth satellite, ie Titan, of sixth planet, ie Saturn, planet number given first), The duration from start to finish is 3h 48m ish if I can add up properly (not always assured), half of that is 1h 54m (check that), add that to start time and we get just over 11:40 ish for midpoint and midtime, not fair from your 11:50 and image showing Titan near Saturnian central meridian, give or take a yard, working in approximate figures.

 

Ya know, this stuff nearly works sometimes!  Anybody would think astronomy was a science wink.gif

 

PS Nice image, as I say if you can discern the disc upon the disc, the disc shadow upon the disc should be easier.  I think I read or worked out somewhere that the shadow was about an arcsec or so across, but that could be my memory playing games.  Also, not sure if the eclipse shadow will be perfectly circular or not, possibly extended west-east, trying to remember back at some simulations I tried in winjupos a while ago and hoping I'm not getting muddled with something else I was looking into recently.

 

EDIT : I think I got shadow occultation and possibly eclipse transit back to front, or at least one of them!  EC.D seems to be satellite in planet shadow.  Looks like shadow transit ellipse can be circular and non-circular depending on where on limb and projection angle, ie over the duration of an event.

 

ADDENDUM : one decentish one for Europeans is about twenty to eight UT on night of 20/11/2024, albeit Saturn at only 30 degrees ish elevation for 50 degree ish latitude.  There may be others that I've missed but I noticed that one.  Moon rise at just after eight UT.


Edited by yuzameh, 29 May 2024 - 01:08 PM.


#11 MisterDan

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 12:51 PM

Just the moon near the middle, no shadow, which falls below the planet right now.

Thanks!  My initial impression was that the spot was too dark. I knew Titan was transiting, but the limb artifact(s) fooled me.

 

Regardless, Mike's image bodes well for upcoming transits, and shadows.

 

Cheers and best wishes.

Dan



#12 dcaponeii

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 02:57 PM

I was thinking either California or Arizona, which are far enough south so that Saturn is at a decent elevation before sunrise. The next Titan transit on June 14 is a longer one and more of us should have a chance to capture part of it.


If the weather cooperates!!

#13 Mike Spooner

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 06:24 PM

Thanks, everyone, for the likes, comments and guidance! I’ve struggled with Saturn processing but hope to work on it a bit more diligently this year. My first thought was that I had caught a shadow transit - finding it was actually Titan was a grateful surprise for certain! 

forgot to mention the second image was 25% of almost 20k frames so a bit cleaner I think (and maybe slightly better focus).
 

But, wow! Those early mornings…

 

Mike


Edited by Mike Spooner, 29 May 2024 - 06:29 PM.

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#14 Kokatha man

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Posted 29 May 2024 - 06:51 PM

As folks are saying, a Titan transit elevates this image to another level Mike! I'm sure that the spirit of your late friend (even if he lives only in the consciousness of his own family & friends) will be smiling over this - a fitting memory! waytogo.gif waytogo.gif waytogo.gif


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#15 Foc

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Posted 30 May 2024 - 03:10 AM

A brilliant start for your Saturn imaging under current low elevations.

A triumph of sleep rationing and modern technology. 

The last ancient image of a Titan transit image that I recall (and from the Southern Hemisphere) was captured years before my younger son's birth so it is nice to see another in his lifetime.



#16 Jupiterastro

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Posted 30 May 2024 - 06:07 AM

You’re so lucky to imaged Titan transit!!!bow.gif




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