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Using an equatorial mount in alt-azimuth mode?

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#1 isolli

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Posted 02 October 2024 - 02:33 AM

Hello,

 

I recently stumbled on a video showing how to use an EQ mount in alt-az mode:

https://www.youtube....h?v=ypHmHNXmkHM

 

I remember that the now-discontinued Avant mount from Skywatcher was marketed as being usable in both EQ and AZ mode.

(Interesting video here, for those who are curious to see it in action: https://www.youtube....?v=wkVergOxt_E)

 

I was curious: can this be generalised to all EQ mounts? I can see this being useful, for instance, if you mount a low-powered scope, or just want a quick session without lengthy setup.

 

Thanks!


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#2 Tony Flanders

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Posted 02 October 2024 - 03:34 AM

I recently stumbled on a video showing how to use an EQ mount in alt-az mode:
https://www.youtube....h?v=ypHmHNXmkHM
... 
I was curious: can this be generalised to all EQ mounts? I can see this being useful, for instance, if you mount a low-powered scope, or just want a quick session without lengthy setup.


The video shows the mount adjusted for latitude 90, where an alt-az mount is an equatorial mount. I'm sure there are some EQ mounts where this isn't possible, but it usually is. It's often the most practical alternative with low-end EQ mounts.


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#3 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 02 October 2024 - 03:38 AM

Hi:

 

In theory it can be done with all or nearly all German Equatorial mounts but it may require some modifications.  Some like the EQ-1 and EQ-2 require no modification, some require removal of a part of two and some require cutting/grinding.

 

This is a EQ-1 mount in the Alt-Az mode. No modifications needed.

 

Celestron ST-80 First Scope 80 EQ.jpg
 
This a Vixen Polaris mount. It appears to have been designed to use as either a GEM or an Alt-Az mount.  
 
5619227-Mizar ALT-AZ Mode.jpg
 
This is a Meade LXD-500B. It required that some metal be removed.  It could still be used as a GEM>
 
5901459-SpaceProbe 130ST ALT-AZ at the Starpad.JPG
 
Jon

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#4 edsmx5

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Posted 02 October 2024 - 03:41 AM

The Celestron cg4 can be converted to az/alt, with some modification.
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#5 edsmx5

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Posted 02 October 2024 - 06:01 AM

The Celestron cg4 can be converted to az/alt, with some modification.



To expand: the cg4 converts easily. I'm all thumbs, and it was easy.
To get it to 90°, there is a bar to remove, and then a bit of metal filing, to allow a tab on the head to pass through the body of the mount. Easy-peasy, even for me. ( to show how "unhandy" I am, I actually - at 69 years young- didn't have a metal file, I had to go buy one. The modification is a piece of cake. It held my AT115EDT ok, but I just didn't trust $1200 sitting side-saddle. The 102mm SV48p rides VERY nicely on it!
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#6 JohnTMN

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Posted 03 October 2024 - 01:04 AM

Uhm, Yes?

Just pick it up, and point it at ya want, use the knobby things to dial in,,

You can even loosen the lock down knobs to swivel that head to where ever you want,

It's that simple,,



#7 isolli

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Posted 03 October 2024 - 02:57 AM

 

Hi:

 

In theory it can be done with all or nearly all German Equatorial mounts but it may require some modifications.  Some like the EQ-1 and EQ-2 require no modification, some require removal of a part of two and some require cutting/grinding.

 

This is a EQ-1 mount in the Alt-Az mode. No modifications needed.

 

 
 
This a Vixen Polaris mount. It appears to have been designed to use as either a GEM or an Alt-Az mount.  
 
 
 
This is a Meade LXD-500B. It required that some metal be removed.  It could still be used as a GEM>
 
 
 
Jon

 

Nice collection of vintage mounts you have there :)


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#8 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 03 October 2024 - 04:23 AM

Nice collection of vintage mounts you have there smile.gif

 

Actually, it's a nice collection of photos of vintage mounts I once owned.  Before mounts like the Vixen Portamount and the SkyTee variations, that is what I did.  

 

Jon


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#9 SeattleScott

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Posted 03 October 2024 - 07:38 AM

To be clear, it does take some time and effort to switch from EQ to Alt Az. It isn’t something where you are going to want to go back and forth depending on your mood. It is more an option to use certain EQ mounts that way and keep them that way.

#10 Sketcher

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Posted 03 October 2024 - 11:47 AM

I was curious: can this be generalised to all EQ mounts? I can see this being useful, for instance, if you mount a low-powered scope, or just want a quick session without lengthy setup.

There are shortcuts to the polar alignment of equatorially mounted telescopes for visual observers.  I have equatorial mounts that I use with my 80mm, 5-inch, and 6-inch refractors.  My tripod-setup-with-polar-alignment times for all of them, even when used from locations where Polaris isn't visible, is quick and painless taking only a few seconds (well under a minute) of my time.

 

That being said, there are situations where I prefer using an alt-az mount, (for terrestrial use and for making horizontal sweeps with vertical increments as was done in the not-so-distant past for visual comet-hunting), but those situations very rarely come up for me these days.  When they do occur, I use one of my homemade alt-az mounts in preference to totally off-setting the more or less (for me) permanent settings of my EQ mounts -- settings that I set once, and never have to adjust again unless I travel to a location with a significantly different latitude, which I almost never do.

 

In all seriousness, any of my German Equatorial Mounts (GEMs) can be setup just as quickly as any of my alt-az mounts for my visual observing purposes.  For astronomical usage (with the exception of old-fashioned visual comet-hunting) I always prefer my GEMs over my alt-az mounts.

 

P.S. one other exception would be to observe a comet that's very close to the north celestial pole.  I knew there was another reason for making my alt-az mounts smile.gif .  But for quick set-up?  For a visual observer?  For me that's not a reason to prefer an alt-az mount.  Then again, I've not been considering go-to mounts.  A go-to equatorial mount is more likely to need greater precision set-up and to require more time to achieve it.  As with so many other things in this hobby, details matter, and often questions get asked without sharing one or more of the relevant details . . .


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#11 dmgriff

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Posted 03 October 2024 - 12:15 PM

The Celestron  AstroMaster with the vixen saddle eq2 only go up to 80 degrees latitude. A no go to 90 degrees.



#12 Echolight

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Posted 03 October 2024 - 01:00 PM

Here's a very old EQ-2 in alt az.

IMG_20230526_201818336~5.jpg

Came with the clamshell and an f8 4.5. Shown with an f4 Starblast.

 

Donated to my brother.

I had two Starblasts.

I now use mine on an old Bogen 3021 with a 77 pound capacity ball head, side saddle for alt az only movement.

IMG_20230625_204950989~7.jpg

 

Heavy duty ball heads work pretty well as alt az with little lightweight scopes.

 


Edited by Echolight, 03 October 2024 - 01:07 PM.

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#13 Gmb1830

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Posted 03 October 2024 - 01:05 PM

I once attempted to change to lat = 0 deg so that the counterweights went mostly between the legs of the tripod and the nominally Dec axis was the Az. 

 

The goal was to use the accessory attachment on the rings (see Jon Isaac's image of the Orion Newtonian with the wonderful SoCal skies) to hold a cell phone on top so I could use Astrohopper.  It works best if the long axis of the phone matches (screen to sky) the long axis of the telescope.  So putting it on the accessory attachment meant it would be flopping out there like a fin, begging to be bumped and misaligned, and maybe affecting balance.

 

Don't do this.  All the weight is on one side of the tripod.  I'd anticipated this and used a tent stake and cord to hold down the opposite leg, but....no.  The counterweights still hit the legs, and it was never steady.  Astrohopper worked pretty well this way, so it was a partial success.

 

Solution is to replace the bolts of the hinge-side (which are now up) of the rings with slightly longer ones as to allow space for L-shaped corner brackets.  The same wood strip I had been using to hold the phone holder goes on those (with new holes).  I'd already planning on replacing the bolts with flush-head ones to allow for Wilcox rings.   



#14 Sky Muse

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Posted 07 October 2024 - 05:12 PM

alt-az mode.jpg


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#15 starfinder123123

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Posted 10 October 2024 - 11:15 PM

I so dislike the EQ mounts. I have a TAL 1 on an EQ and it is a pain to use. I understand aligning it to Polaris, but finding anything requires great deal of maneuvering. Just hate it. I would not take another even if given me for free. Give me a dob any time of the day. 



#16 Oldfracguy

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Posted 12 October 2024 - 12:55 PM

Hello,

 

 

I was curious: can this be generalised to all EQ mounts? I can see this being useful, for instance, if you mount a low-powered scope, or just want a quick session without lengthy setup.

 

Thanks!

It is totally useful to be able to convert an EQ mount to function as an Alt-Az mount, but not all EQ mounts are capable of being converted. In order for a conversion to Alt-Az to be possible, the EQ polar axis has to be able to be rotated all the way over to the 90° Latitude position, pointing straight up.  Then it must be able to be locked in that position somehow.  Here is a Celestron CG-4 converted to Alt-Az mode:

 

101_1581.JPG

 

 

It is locked in the 90° position by a notch I had to file on the top of the bracket that normally holds the rear Latitiude position adjustment screw:

 

101_1518.JPG

 

 

It has become my workhorse mount for quick sessions as well as overnight excursions to dark sky locations.  I've mounted refractors, SCTs, Maks and Newtonians on it.

 

Of course, once a year, I convert it back to GEM mode and level the mount, reinstall the counterweights, perform a polar alignments, etc. in order to maintain my license:

 

101_2885.JPG


Edited by Oldfracguy, 12 October 2024 - 12:57 PM.

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#17 Max Headroom

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Posted 12 October 2024 - 01:26 PM

Hello,

 

I recently stumbled on a video showing how to use an EQ mount in alt-az mode:

https://www.youtube....h?v=ypHmHNXmkHM

 

I remember that the now-discontinued Avant mount from Skywatcher was marketed as being usable in both EQ and AZ mode.

(Interesting video here, for those who are curious to see it in action: https://www.youtube....?v=wkVergOxt_E)

 

I was curious: can this be generalised to all EQ mounts? I can see this being useful, for instance, if you mount a low-powered scope, or just want a quick session without lengthy setup.

 

Thanks!

My Meade ETX 90 can be either.  The tripod has a tilting base that is an adjustable 'wedge' for EQ use, or you can leave it flat for Alt-Az use.  Just have to tell the Autostar which mode you're set up for.

As far as a quick set up, without a lengthy set up, I often do a fake set up with the ETX.  Point it north, set the tube in the home position, hit the two star alignment, just accept the alignment where ever it lands.  Cheesy, but it's usually close enough.  An even cheesier version of this is to park the scope at the end of a session, and skip the alignment entirely at the nest session.  Just need to point the scope north and power it on.  


Edited by Max Headroom, 12 October 2024 - 02:06 PM.


#18 edsmx5

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Posted 12 October 2024 - 02:03 PM

It is totally useful to be able to convert an EQ mount to function as an Alt-Az mount, but not all EQ mounts are capable of being converted. In order for a conversion to Alt-Az to be possible, the EQ polar axis has to be able to be rotated all the way over to the 90° Latitude position, pointing straight up. Then it must be able to be locked in that position somehow. Here is a Celestron CG-4 converted to Alt-Az mode:

101_1581.JPG


It is locked in the 90° position by a notch I had to file on the top of the bracket that normally holds the rear Latitiude position adjustment screw:

101_1518.JPG


It has become my workhorse mount for quick sessions as well as overnight excursions to dark sky locations. I've mounted refractors, SCTs, Maks and Newtonians on it.

Of course, once a year, I convert it back to GEM mode and level the mount, reinstall the counterweights, perform a polar alignments, etc. in order to maintain my license:

101_2885.JPG



It was your threads that showed me the cg4 conversion: easy-peasy.
Now, on mine, I removed that plate, but had to file some of the body to get the tab far enough.

It carried my AT115EDT, 2" diagonal, and 2"28/82 with no issues; I just didn't like it hanging out like that. My ( two ) 102mm ride on it very nicely.

OMG, I gotta reconfigure sometime soon, I don't want the EQ squad coming after me :-)

Edited by edsmx5, 12 October 2024 - 02:04 PM.



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