27 replies to this topic

[Son of Norway]

Has anyone found that the rigors of astrophotography have had an effect on the health of your heart? What has been your experience and  have you had to make any changes or accommodations in your enjoyment of the hobby as a result?

 

By rigors I'm thinking about long nights without adequate sleep maybe even several nights in a row, many hours spent out in the cold particularly at far away dark sites, driving without adequate sleep, inadequate nutrition, over-consumption of caffeinated drinks, etc.

 

Effects on your heart might include increased Afib, PVC's, other arrhythmias, tiredness, light-headedness, etc.

 

Thanks for sharing!

 

 

[Andros246]

Cant be any worse than the average hobbies like drinking, smoking, playing video games all night long, and the effects of being a single parent with kids.

I think they have it worse on their hearts.

[yayglobulars]

I think that the cosmic vertigo that we can often experience is a net positive for our well-being. Perhaps it's somewhat attenuated by grumbling about sensor tilt, guiding errors, and wind gusts. But what do I know - I usually have a barrel-aged stout nearby on long imaging nights. 

[SgrB2]

As long as you go to church each week, you'll be fine.

[TOMDEY]

Seriously, a topic best addressed in the context of Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD). The symptoms you enumerate all point in that direction. Whether the fixation is self-abusive inefficient astrophotography or something else hardly matters. Two ways to handle the overarching concern: 1) Diminish the stressors by backing off or making the experience more ergo/mental comfortable... home dome, semi-automatic or entirely automatic data collection, limiting one's dedicated hours to not exceed e.g. two hours a day --- what we call ~smart astrophotography~ --- what any hobby should be --- relaxing. 2) See an analyst for evaluation and treatment.

 

The symptoms are triggered by anxiety; remove the cause of the anxiety and the symptoms are likely to abate.

 

PS: Keeping fit (an hour of structured exercise for each hour of astrophotography) is also inoculating. That assures that your body and soul are more capable of comfortably dealing with higher levels of stress than the average bloke.    Tom

 

I actually did/do all those things. That allows one to (finally) enjoy the hobby and maintain good health.

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Edited by TOMDEY, 03 December 2024 - 07:29 PM.

[gstrumol]

I have one word for you: solar!

 

Constantly changing, do it in the daytime and never lose a minute of sleep. No fumbling/tripping in the dark. Worse comes to worse - you can image through a window!

 

I mean, how many images of M42 does one need? 

[Michael Covington]

I've been a serious astrophotographer for decades without over-straining my body.  If I'm up all night, I catch up on my sleep in the daytime.  I don't consume abnormal amounts of caffeine.  There's no reason your nutrition should suffer.  Nor do you need to be cold.  (Check out www.refrigiwear.com -- they have gear that will keep you warm in Arctic temperatures!)  Just give a high enough priority to taking care of your body.  After all, we do this because we enjoy it!  Why make yourself suffer?
 

[david_od]

Has anyone found that the rigors of astrophotography have had an effect on the health of your heart? What has been your experience and  have you had to make any changes or accommodations in your enjoyment of the hobby as a result?

 

By rigors I'm thinking about long nights without adequate sleep maybe even several nights in a row, many hours spent out in the cold particularly at far away dark sites, driving without adequate sleep, inadequate nutrition, over-consumption of caffeinated drinks, etc.

 

Effects on your heart might include increased Afib, PVC's, other arrhythmias, tiredness, light-headedness, etc.

 

Thanks for sharing!

While the symptoms that you describe could in principle be associated, among other things, to changing sleep patterns, inadequate nutrition, etc, one of the main factors nowadays, if not the biggest, is sequelae from repeated infections with sars-cov-2. This has been happening worldwide since 2020 but it's only growing in time, and numerous studies and clinical data point in the same direction, sadly. I see a marked growing concern about this in other, more "diurnal" communities as well.

 

That said, I'm still been drastically reducing the number of long or sleepless observing nights (which my work has allowed for, until now), among other things, since I know they can also have effects in my health in the near or far future. Sometimes I've considered going full solar, but I love the night sky just too much.

[yayglobulars]

All good responses and insight here, to which I'll add (on a serious note vs. my earlier quip): If you're experiencing any of the symptoms you list and they're causing you concern, there's no substitute for a visit to an HCP.

[TOMDEY]

'Tis the season! --- By analogy > shoveling snow: If you exercise regularly year round, that first snow storm is taxing, but not dangerous to your health. If you don't... going out there and shoveling can be downright life-threatening. My mom worked in the hospital ~Emergency Room~ night shift for decades. The 1st snow storm of the season is what they called "heart attack weather" --- confirmed by the evidence of severely heightened arrivals at the ER, from mild to serious to DOA.    Tom

 

"In medical terms, DOA stands for "dead on arrival". It's used to describe a patient who is already deceased when they arrive at the hospital. This can happen in transit or if the patient is found dead outside of the hospital. A patient may also be considered DOA if they are pronounced dead after unsuccessful resuscitation in the ambulance or trauma room." ~

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[WadeH237]

I do astrophotography because I enjoy it, and because it's engaging enough to take my mind off of the real world for a while.  As such, I have to believe that it's good for my health.  My wife assures me that I am a nicer person when I get to do it.

 

I am almost 60 years old and in what I consider good health.  I am able to easily manage my astro gear.  I can easily lift my C14 on and off of the mount.  For much of the year, I do all of my astronomy from home.  My imaging is fully automated, and I don't do a whole lot of visual from home.  As such, there are few physical demands.  I get plenty of sleep, and don't really spent more than about 30 minutes working on any given session's capture.  I process the data at my leisure, and often get many months behind.

 

In the summer time, I try to travel to a dark sky site for as many new moons as possible.  When I do that, I like to travel for at least a week at a time.  While I am out, I am more physically active than when at home.  I like to make it an immersive experience, so that's when I do most of my visual work.  When I was younger, I used to try and make every night an "all nighter" for visual.  But now that I am older, I observe when I feel like it, and I head to sleep when I feel like it.

 

I do use either a camper or my motorhome when I am at a dark sky site, so I sleep quite comfortably in the field, even if the weather turns poor.

[peterc]

For myself - automation rules. I don't tend to do a lot of visual so that covers my main interest, astrophotography,

After things are proven on my set up I set up the run and go to bed! Let it do the work. I will set an alarm for some things but mostly for the end to close things up. And often go back to bed!

When I change scopes out, or like recently started using a NINA/MELe combo, I'll set an alarm for meridian flip to make sure it runs.

As others said - good diet, exercise should be a part of a lifestyle. Leave things to automation and get the next important thing - sleep!

[archiebald]

For myself - automation rules. I don't tend to do a lot of visual so that covers my main interest, astrophotography,

After things are proven on my set up I set up the run and go to bed! Let it do the work. I will set an alarm for some things but mostly for the end to close things up. And often go back to bed!

When I change scopes out, or like recently started using a NINA/MELe combo, I'll set an alarm for meridian flip to make sure it runs.

As others said - good diet, exercise should be a part of a lifestyle. Leave things to automation and get the next important thing - sleep!

Agree with this wholeheartedly!! 

 

I really enjoy the tinkering part of the hobby and getting parts working together, which has the added bonus of usually ending up with more automation.

 

With my current rigs, I spend maybe 15-20 minutes setting up, doing PA and setting rotation for the target, after that I'm straight indoors away from the night chills or mosquitoes and off to bed at a proper time.  In the morning, get out of bed maybe 10 minutes earlier in the morning to strip down and put away.

 

One day I'll maybe get a rotator so I can automate two targets through a night.

 

Probably the most stress and late nights I have is when I'm processing and keep thinking, hmm, just another tweak here, or another stretch there.

[psienide]

I value my sleep and understand the health impact. That's why I worked as quickly as I feasibly could to put together a system that I can set up in 30 minutes and image all night unattended and unmonitored.

I have never lost sleep for a dark site yet. One day I will, but for now i'm getting 30 hours on average per target from bortle 9 and not losing sleep, freezing my butt off, or skipping meals.

[PIEJr]

In a word, Remote.

My equipment lives at the ready. I just take my computer briefcase out and set up, plug in, turn on, and drop out.

I come in the house to my man cave and use Tight Vnc to connect the laptop out there to my desktop in here.

 

I was running my equipment around 5:30 PM (17:30 Hrs), then went to have dinner with the DIL and Grandkids ~7:00PM (19:00)

Just got home at 8:30ish (20:30 Hrs) and everything is still sequencing.

 

A little later I'll go to bed and watch TV, put on my CPAP mask, go to sleep, and wake up to a set of files with my mount parked.

I like to get things going, then my time is my own.

 

Usually, I watch as the images come in and fiddle on the Internet. But tonight, Patty invited us over for a pot of chili.

 

Anyway, go remote with NINA. Let your equipment work while you relax and rest.

And since you didn't ask, I had "The Widowmaker" heart attack in March 2010.

Have a stint in my RCA. 

Astrophotography the way I do it is fine health wise.

You don't have to kill yourself to do this sport.

Work smarter, not harder.

Edited by PIEJr, 04 December 2024 - 12:00 AM.

[Cliff Hipsher]

I spent almost 22 years (21 years, 11 months and 10 days) on active duty in the US Navy.  As a result I am a night owl.  I get up between 5:30 and 6:00 AM every morning and I rarely go to bed before 2:00 AM each night.  I have done more 24 and 36 hour days than I can count. Besides engaging is astrophotography, I am a martial artist, drone builder and pilot, Honda Trike rider, and caregiver for my wife (Lung Cancer survivor) and my 93 year old mother-in-law. My martial arts training and my other activities give me the time to decompress emotionally and physically.  I am 73 years old.  As for being out in the cold late at night, BTDT by growing up in Flagstaff AZ.  To avoid that environment I chose to use ASI Air Plus controllers on my rigs (I have three) so I can monitor things from the comfort of my living room.  I didn't live to be this old by being stupid..  

[rfcooley]

Let me see...

 

I survived a widow maker heart attack, had to give up my career of 35 years. Find some more suitable employment, open heart surgery because I didn't listen well. Make major shifts in lifestyle, not easy to do.  Find some way to de-stress from a Type A personality and a work centered ethic,didn't have time for that, things had to get done. During those years I had  my telescopes but had trouble finding time to spend with them. If I had I would have likely avoided a lot of these issues, hind sight is 20/20.  One of my Cardiologist visited me one day at home with a mechanical problem he needed some help with and was aware of my past career figured I'd have an answer. We were in my little work shop I had at the time and he saw the telescopes. He asked me if I used them? I had used them off and on since I was about 8 years old when I could find the time. "Do you enjoy it does it relax you?"  Yes it always had and still does on occasions  " Better find more occasions. Otherwise you may not make retirement to really enjoy them. The fact I had survived this far was a miracle in itself."  Did some soul searching, quit my job for something that allowed more time to pursue that which inspired my wonder. Took a 30 to 40 hour job a week in the gaming industry which allowed some flexibility. Became a staff volunteer for a research grade college observatory. Lost some weight, another small shift in lifestyle, diet and exercise and spending much more time behind the eyepieces and camera lenses of high a grade research facility. Heart improved, blood pressure dropped. Anxiety which I was sure I never had, left. (You never know what you lost until it was gone sorta thing.)  Six months ago full age retirement came and I'm only getting started. However, I have some rules and regulations I now follow, "Eat, drink, sleep, laugh, take a break and slip in a nap or two."  Cardiologist recommended and Doctor approved!  The only cloud on the horizon some people see is that they will have to put up with me longer.

 

A short story of what I experienced in heart and health.

 

Clear Skies, Never Lose the Wonder,

 

RF

[kg7]

All of the new research on sleep deprivation is very concerning.  Even shorting your sleep schedule by a few hours one night per week has a measurable impact on your health, and that's something that virtually every astronomer does regularly.  It's not just heart disease but also endocrine disruption, dementia, and immune response.  Your body needs sleep to function properly!

 

On the other hand, eating red meat once per week also has a measurable impact on your health and most Americans do that all the time without giving it a second thought.  Can I keep my telescope if I give up cheeseburgers?

[Drothgeb]

My wife was involved in NIH’s sleep study program for many years. Yes, irregular sleep patterns affect your health in many ways, most of them negative.

 

Will it kill you? Maybe not.

 

But like I always say, after being involved a number of accidents on skies, motorcycles, cars, and developing arthritis at most injury locations “ What doesn’t kill you, leaves a mark that may haunt you for the rest of your life”. 

[PIEJr]

My CPAP is my competition now. LOL!

And getting my Astrophotography on a remote operation allows my sleep therapy to flourish.

After my career of electrical repair and troubleshooting, perfecting things comes second nature.

So, Astrophotography is a perfect hobby for me, as long as I'm not hoisting my 35+ pound telescope up and down every day.

But I like to "Rage Against the Machine". My CPAP keeps score of how my nights sleep goes.

Best is a 100. It P's me off when it takes points away because of "events" during the night. Stupid machine! Its JOB is to help avoid "Events". (An event being where I stop breathing, then start suddenly again. hence, why I have a CPAP in the first place.)

So having finally reached the point I dreamed of 10 years ago, with my AP being run by NINA and able to pick a target easier than pickin a booger, I can sleep 7 hours or more, score a 100 on my blasted CPAP, and get my full nights images to play with.

 

I am, or was, a Steak and Tator's guy. I'd have a steak and potato for dinner several times a week. Cholesterol in the Arteries is the culprit that leads to a "heart attack". Our affluent eating lifestyles.

Remember the commercials we always saw? BEEF! It's what's for Dinner!

After you reach the heart attack age you, or at least I, look at a piece of beef and see cholesterol.

When I could travel again, the wife and I made a trip to visit Mom (her foster Mom) up in Roseville, CA. Rollin along we were ready for some lunch.

I felt like going in and sitting down to eat. So, I pulled up the horses at a Denny's diner.

We went and ordered our lunches then began looking over the nutritional sheet at our table. Well, that was a mistake.

Trying to be mindful of my new dietary needs, I ordered a Turkey Club sandwich. The Nutritional sheet shown I had ordered 2460 milligrams of sodium, on my 2000 milligrams a day restriction.

So much for trying to eat something healthy. (I am NOT a fan of Turkey)

I've grown accustomed to my lifestyle changes. Reducing sodium was not hard because I didn't usually add salt anyway. I'm not a worry wart reading all the labels of things I buy.

The wife likes chicken, she could eat chicken 7 days a week. Not me, not to that extent. But I like Salmon, especially if I smoke the portions myself. And my doctors like that I like salmon too.

I like to BBQ on a spit a nice Pork roast from a pork loin. Any fat cooks off mostly in the hour or so it's going roundy-round in the barby.

 

Changes, life is full of changes, and adaptions. My Astrophotography has adapted to my health needs, like trying to beat the CPAP machine by allowing my equipment to work its magic alone out in the cold and dark. Sweet NINA keeping things on course for a good night.

If I want to, I have an extra security camera we wound up with mounted so it can look over my mount and telescope. So, when I get up to pee in the wee hours (Pun intended), I can tap up the camera on my smarter-than-me-phone and see if the telescope has parked, indication that it finished. (It hadn't this morning at 02:54 hours. But was at 07:00 when I got up.) Also noting the machine had cheated again and took away a point giving me a 99 out of 100 points. Stupid machine!

Showing my equipment and NINA are doing their job better than that dam CPAP is.

 

So yes, Astronomy can make life better. Nobody is taxing the stars, yet. And nobody is saying when we can or can't take pictures.

And NINA is telling me, go, sleep tight. I've got this. Have a good night.

It's all in how you want to do it. Because we all do it differently.

I'll be 75 next March, and 15 years out from my heart attack. But 11 years into my Astro stuff.

Lovin it.

 

Clear Skies!

[555aaa]

Lots of good responses. One thing I try to do to limit frustration is to have a secondary plan for something to observe with binoculars because you know things are gonna not work

[Son of Norway]

Thanks to all for sharing.  I am getting up the courage to trust NINA with my EQ6.

[Cliff Hipsher]

I am 73 years old. I go to bed late, I get up early. I go full tilt Boogie all day long.  I don't eat junk food.  I don't like to stay indoors.  Sunlight is good for you, especially early morning sunlight from just after dawn. It resets your sleep cycle.  Standing barefoot on grass or bare soil (AKA Earth Grounding) is also good for you.  I train in TaeKwonDo so I get frequent full body workouts.  I recently started supplementing with a B vitamin complex and a supplement called TMG.  In 30 days I lost 30 pounds (I was pushing 190) and right now I'm hovering between 145 and 150.  My watery, gritty, burning eyes are gone, my hair color came back (I was totally white headed before), my arm hair the hair "down there" has thickened, I have black hair growing on my legs and face, and I feel like a million dollars.

[kathyastro]

Not wanting to stay up all night is a major reason why I built my observatory.  These days, I'll check the forecast to see if it looks like a clear night.  I'll pick a target, fire up the equipment, program the sequence and then go to bed.  In the morning, all being well, I will have a pile of frames to stack. 

 

I might start the stacking process before breakfast, so that, by the time the caffeine kicks in, I have something ready to process.

[unimatrix0]

As the cold set in, I am even lazy to go out to check the stars. So I have a cheap security camera from amazon, that is always on looking at the sky. 

It takes clicking on the app on my phone to see if it's starry sky or cloudy - Like last night the weather said clear, but it was cloudy anyway. 

 

If it's a starry sky, then all I gotta do is take the cover off from my mount +attach the scope and 2 cables, turn on Asiair and go inside. 

My mount has been polar aligned since August and the PA is still good

 

Since August though, I got so lazy - and because of no major storms or winds happened- that the scope is sitting on the mount and the entire thing is just covered with a grill cover and that's it. 

 

It's literally flipping on the power switch and that's it. 

 

From inside I pick whatever I can image and set up a plan and go to sleep. Asiair will take care of the imaging, parks my mount at astronomical dawn. 

 

I usually don't even go out anymore in the morning, I just log into the Asiair with my folder explorer and copy paste out out all the subs to my hard drive.

 

My newest procedure is, Asiair does deep sky stacking inside the unit so I do a quick stacking with flats and darks and biases already saved there, just to get an idea what I'm gonna get. 

 

 

 I get my 8hrs of sleep. 

 

I strongly urge people to get their automation in order, sleeping very little is not helpful with chronic illnesses, especially cardiovascular issues. 

Edited by unimatrix0, 07 December 2024 - 01:47 PM.