24 replies to this topic

[Biggarygary]

Looking for advice on my first refractor to be used purely for deep sky astrophotography.  I currently have an EdgeHD 8" with the .7x reducer mounted on a juwei-17.  I also have a seestar s50.  Budget is <$1500, preferably below $1000.  I love the edge for planetary, but the guiding gets annoying when I keep losing stars in the OAG. The plate solving failures also get frustrating on the SCT.

 

I impulsively purchased the SVBONY SV555 54mm APO on Amazon when I saw it was only $300.  I'm debating whether to cancel or not because I already have the seestar s50, which has a similar focal length.  Is there much benefit to getting such a similar size?  I realize I won't have the field rotation issues, but I'm not sure it's much of a gain.  

 

Before the impulse order, I was looking at the 60-80mm range and thought the Askar 71f looked promising.  I was looking for something that is a bit easier to work with than the edge so I can spend more time imaging and less time fighting the scope.  

 

I also debated just getting the hyperstar for my existing scope, but I'm not great at collimation and worried I'll continue to have to fight the scope.

 

Any advice on what I should look for would be greatly appreciated. 

 

My other equipment is the ZWO OAG, ASI 533MC Pro, ASI 174 mini for guiding, ZWO EAF, and Asiair mini.  I'm in a Bortles 6 and have a lot of trees/houses in the way, so most of my targets have to be high in the sky.  My eastern view is totally blocked.

 

Thank you!

[hyiger]

If you are already frustrated with the SCT, don’t get a hyperstar. Having owned one before it will only compound your frustration (my opinion only). I would consider any of the AstroTech triplets (the EDT series). Anything 60mm and above with the 533MC is going to be infinity better than the SeeStar in terms of quality of the final result. Not only due to the larger aperture but the 533 is a better/larger sensor and you can take much longer exposures on your EQ mount since you don’t have to deal with field rotation anymore. 

Edited by hyiger, 06 December 2024 - 11:57 AM.

[f430]

Just my opinion, but I think and good quality 50/80mm refractor with a good suitable camera will out preform the Seestar in more or less every way.

The one advantage of the Seestar is that it self processes, but the images I've seen on the Smart Telescope forum section here, while okay, certainly aren't impressive compared to images in the other photo sections here. 

You already have an Edge HD, so you already know how to point/guide/image/and must have some experience processing. 

 

Like I said, just my opinion,

John

[Biggarygary]

If you are already frustrated with the SCT, don’t get a hyperstar. Having owned one before it will only compound your frustration (my opinion only). I would consider any of the AstroTech triplets (the EDT series). Anything 60mm and above with the 533MC is going to be infinity better than the SeeStar in terms of quality of the final result. Not only due to the larger aperture but the 533 is a better/larger sensor and you can take much longer exposures on your EQ mount since you don’t have to deal with field rotation anymore. 

Thanks for the advice!  That was my gut feeling on the hyperstar, so thanks for confirming.  I'm not as familiar with astrotech, so I'll check that line out.  Thanks again!

[Biggarygary]

Just my opinion, but I think and good quality 50/80mm refractor with a good suitable camera will out preform the Seestar in more or less every way.

The one advantage of the Seestar is that it self processes, but the images I've seen on the Smart Telescope forum section here, while okay, certainly aren't impressive compared to images in the other photo sections here. 

You already have an Edge HD, so you already know how to point/guide/image/and must have some experience processing. 

 

Like I said, just my opinion,

John

That's great to know.  Thanks for the reply.  I know how to do planetary processing, but am still learning how to do it for deep sky imaging.  I've mostly done clean-up and some stacking of seestar images with siril/graxpert.  I haven't bought pixinsight yet, but eventually will - mostly sticking to the free tools for now.

[Astrojensen]

The Seestar is very limited in what it can do, in regards to filters. And the sensor is fixed, so you can't get a wider field, for example, or upgrade when a better sensor becomes available. You can do all of that with a refractor. 

 

Even a smartphone on a small refractor can outperform the Seestar. What the Seestar has going for it is ease of use. 

 

 

Clear skies!

Thomas, Denmark 

[Astrola72]

I agree with what's been said already. I don't know about the Svbony but if it were me I'd cancel the order and go to Astronomics (use the link on the right hand side of this page). They're having a pretty good sale right now.

 

Joe

[SilverLitz]

I would expect you would get much better results with triplet APO and cooled astrocamera.  For DSO imaging, you need EQ mount and cooled camera for longer exposures, and separate camera will give you filter flexibility.   With you budgetary restrictions, I would suggest looking used, and keeping the aperture 90mm and under.  Used Stellarvue SVX080T (480mm @ f/6) come up frequently around your price and many include the necessary field flattener.  If looking new, HPS has Apertura 75Q (405mm @ f/5.4) on sale for $1000, and the new Askar SQA55 ($800, 264mm @ f/4.8) is getting great reviews; neither of these will need any additional field flatteners.  The shorter FL SQA55 will be the most limited w.r.t. to targets, being the best on the very large FoV (of course depending on camera sensor size).

 

https://www.highpoin...actor-telescope

 

https://agenaastro.c...-telescope.html

[vtornado]

From seeing my clubs astro photos at our meetings,  A  60mm ED refractor, on a good mount, with a good camera, and experienced post processing produces better images than the See-Star.

 

However .... a lot more dollars, a lot more time and a lot more experience are needed.  It's up to you how far you want to go.

 

I'm stopping at the see-star level of quality.  I don't have the dollars, time or patience.

[Biggarygary]

I would expect you would get much better results with triplet APO and cooled astrocamera.  For DSO imaging, you need EQ mount and cooled camera for longer exposures, and separate camera will give you filter flexibility.   With you budgetary restrictions, I would suggest looking used, and keeping the aperture 90mm and under.  Used Stellarvue SVX080T (480mm @ f/6) come up frequently around your price and many include the necessary field flattener.  If looking new, HPS has Apertura 75Q (405mm @ f/5.4) on sale for $1000, and the new Askar SQA55 ($800, 264mm @ f/4.8) is getting great reviews; neither of these will need any additional field flatteners.  The shorter FL SQA55 will be the most limited w.r.t. to targets, being the best on the very large FoV (of course depending on camera sensor size).

 

https://www.highpoin...actor-telescope

 

https://agenaastro.c...-telescope.html

Great advice.  I'll take a look at that Stellarvue you recommend and see if I can find one used.  I do have an EQ mount (juwei-17) and cooled camera (asi533mc pro).

[hyiger]

Great advice.  I'll take a look at that Stellarvue you recommend and see if I can find one used.  I do have an EQ mount (juwei-17) and cooled camera (asi533mc pro).

The AstroTech scopes on Astronomics (Cloudy Night’s sponsor) are 5% off (when not on sale) for CN members. They are excellent scopes for the money. 

Edited by hyiger, 06 December 2024 - 05:33 PM.

[SilverLitz]

If you can find a used AT92 at a good price, that would be terrific especially if paired with the Esprit 100 FF (AT did not have dedicated FF for the AT92, but the Esprit's works well).  I have seen one on CN classifieds a few months ago with the Esprit FF for less than $1500.

 

Of AT's new scopes, the AT90EDX (540mm @ f/6) has a lot folks saying good things.  

 

https://astronomics....dbe0adf07&_ss=c

[f430]

Just be sure to get an APO, with field flattener, and not a doublet of some sort.

[Sacred Heart]

Me, I'd cancel that scope order. Don't buy on impulse.  Buy after researching, know why you want it also.  I'd get a good quality 80mm - 90mm, 500mm to 600mm focal length scope.   I try to locate owners of the scope if possible, good honest answers.  

 

With four or five hours worth of images, eight to ten even better, and some processing you will beat that seestar every time.

 

Just me,  Joe

[cos]

Okay, here's where I need some real experience and advice. I have a seestars50, I also have a 50 mm triplet that is connected to an ASI 533MC, I can put this on my AM 5 mount and the whole thing is pretty portable. The upside from the triplet is that I can also do longer exposures with a cool camera, and I get a bit bigger field of view because of the 533 sensor. It seems like I have a lot of redundancy here. Which of the two would you get rid of? I'm kind of in the market for a new camera and I have to sell off some gear. Seems like selling the seestar leaves a lot of options open because I could take my new camera and use it on that along with my other scopes. I really wish the ASI air did live stacking with the AI noise reduction automatically. That would pretty much push me over the edge to getting rid of the seestar. Hassle of taking calibration frames on the ASI air kind of wants me to keep the seeatar. At the same time I'm never really stoked about anything I get out of the seeatar. What are you guys think?

[LDW47]

Okay, here's where I need some real experience and advice. I have a seestars50, I also have a 50 mm triplet that is connected to an ASI 533MC, I can put this on my AM 5 mount and the whole thing is pretty portable. The upside from the triplet is that I can also do longer exposures with a cool camera, and I get a bit bigger field of view because of the 533 sensor. It seems like I have a lot of redundancy here. Which of the two would you get rid of? I'm kind of in the market for a new camera and I have to sell off some gear. Seems like selling the seestar leaves a lot of options open because I could take my new camera and use it on that along with my other scopes. I really wish the ASI air did live stacking with the AI noise reduction automatically. That would pretty much push me over the edge to getting rid of the seestar. Hassle of taking calibration frames on the ASI air kind of wants me to keep the seeatar. At the same time I'm never really stoked about anything I get out of the seeatar. What are you guys think?

It sounds like getting rid of the SS is the way to go and concentrate on bigger and better. Why hesitate, eh.

[Phil Cowell]

Keep the SeeStar it’s a great compliment and it already shows more than you’d get visually with a small APO. Use SETI Astro Suite and Siril to touch up the SeeStar images. As for an APO a fast 80mm is a sweet spot. The AT80EDT has good reviews and the Esprit 80 with the Starizona reducer flattener. Both do a fine job imaging/EAA/NV. Check out the images of the APO’s your interested in on Astrobin to get an idea of capabilities and what kit is used with the scope for the image.

[cos]

I think I agree but wonder if I will regret it in the long run.

 

The simplicity of the seestar is pretty good but now that everyone is telling me to polar align it and use it in EQ mode, I question if its any easier that just busting out my real AP rig. 

 

Upsides, Simple, but not really that simple if I choose EQ mode comparatively 

Upside, light weight, but I cant see me ever hauling this on an airplane anyway, and the difference between the AM5 and 50mm setup vs the seestar is not enormous

 

Downside, no longer exposures

Downside, sensor is not that great and pretty small

 

At the moment I have 2 scope, 2 mounts and 1 camera and a seestar, I think if I sold the seestar, I would be close to having 2 scopes, 2 mounts and 2 cameras, (which seems awesome, but considering I barely have time to use one setup, I dont know if I just like the idea...)

 

Thanks for your input to those that commented. 

 

 

 

It sounds like getting rid of the SS is the way to go and concentrate on bigger and better. Why hesitate, eh.

[Phil Cowell]

Agree the SeeStar isn’t really an EQ solution, it seems like a feature some pushed for so they added it. 
Your AM5 with a pole master or similar will make polar alignment much easier. 
The AM5 is pretty travel friendly a tablet or laptop can control it and you ASIAIR plus a small APO around 80mm.

If traveling by car the SeeStar is a breeze to just put behind a seat. Easy to charge from the car while driving in case you forget before heading out the door. The two would provide a combo with many functions. You could use the AM5 APO combo visually while the SeeStar captures images. Its a common use case. Or capturing two targets at the same time with each system hitting the more suitable target.

 

 

I think I agree but wonder if I will regret it in the long run.

 

The simplicity of the seestar is pretty good but now that everyone is telling me to polar align it and use it in EQ mode, I question if its any easier that just busting out my real AP rig. 

 

Upsides, Simple, but not really that simple if I choose EQ mode comparatively 

Upside, light weight, but I cant see me ever hauling this on an airplane anyway, and the difference between the AM5 and 50mm setup vs the seestar is not enormous

 

Downside, no longer exposures

Downside, sensor is not that great and pretty small

 

At the moment I have 2 scope, 2 mounts and 1 camera and a seestar, I think if I sold the seestar, I would be close to having 2 scopes, 2 mounts and 2 cameras, (which seems awesome, but considering I barely have time to use one setup, I dont know if I just like the idea...)

 

Thanks for your input to those that commented. 

Edited by Phil Cowell, 25 March 2025 - 06:20 PM.

[Sacred Heart]

Okay, here's where I need some real experience and advice. I have a seestars50, I also have a 50 mm triplet that is connected to an ASI 533MC, I can put this on my AM 5 mount and the whole thing is pretty portable. The upside from the triplet is that I can also do longer exposures with a cool camera, and I get a bit bigger field of view because of the 533 sensor. It seems like I have a lot of redundancy here. Which of the two would you get rid of? I'm kind of in the market for a new camera and I have to sell off some gear. Seems like selling the seestar leaves a lot of options open because I could take my new camera and use it on that along with my other scopes. I really wish the ASI air did live stacking with the AI noise reduction automatically. That would pretty much push me over the edge to getting rid of the seestar. Hassle of taking calibration frames on the ASI air kind of wants me to keep the seeatar. At the same time I'm never really stoked about anything I get out of the seeatar. What are you guys think?

cos, 

 

If you already have this,

 

ASI533MC Pro, ASI2600MC Pro Duo

AT60EDP, AT80EDT,  AT115EDT, ETX125
AM5, Sirius EQ-G, Seestar S50

 

You already have everything you need, except maybe a full frame camera.  Yes / No???

 

The AM5, extremely portable, extremely capable with CW and CW shaft, you throw any of those scopes on it and shoot whatever you want.

 

The seestar in convenient,  but to me taking calibration frames is not a hassle, it is just part of the routine.  I only take bias and flats, I do not take darks. That is just my personal choice.

 

With a little sweat equity and proper planing you can swap scopes no problem and have something like the seestar and a whole lot more.  Add an OAG and guide camera and you are done.  Add a 2X barlow / powermate and planetary camera and you have the planets and Moon, a few eyepieces and diagonal, you have visual.

 

So, again just me, the seestar goes if anything is to go.

 

Just me,  Joe

[quilty]

Yes. (still worth it)

[cos]

cos,

If you already have this,

ASI533MC Pro, ASI2600MC Pro Duo
AT60EDP, AT80EDT, AT115EDT, ETX125
AM5, Sirius EQ-G, Seestar S50

You already have everything you need, except maybe a full frame camera. Yes / No???

The AM5, extremely portable, extremely capable with CW and CW shaft, you throw any of those scopes on it and shoot whatever you want.

The seestar in convenient, but to me taking calibration frames is not a hassle, it is just part of the routine. I only take bias and flats, I do not take darks. That is just my personal choice.

With a little sweat equity and proper planing you can swap scopes no problem and have something like the seestar and a whole lot more. Add an OAG and guide camera and you are done. Add a 2X barlow / powermate and planetary camera and you have the planets and Moon, a few eyepieces and diagonal, you have visual.

So, again just me, the seestar goes if anything is to go.

Just me, Joe

[cos]

Thanks for the replies. I have spent some time with the seestar in EQ mode and now I think I'm about to pull the trigger and sell it. The one thing that is nice is the in body image processing. But if I use darks and flats with asiair live stacking it's pretty close as far as quality. The ability to guide combined with a cooled larger sensor seems to offset any of the seestar (easiness). Still thinking the seestar is great, but the difference in setup is about 2 minutes. I did a side by side comparison on my evoguide50ed with the starizona ff on the asi533mc and the seestar and there's a huge difference. And it's not the aperture or focal length, it's the sensor and guiding.

[PIEJr]

Astrophotography goal, ED triplet, or Petzval.

If, you didn't say the <$1500, I would have nudged you toward something like the AT130EDT I, and a lot of others here have.

If you'd like to stay smaller, Astrotech has these little 60mm Petzval's they are closing out for $600. Such a deal!

 

I spent around 9-10 years with my Orion ED80T CF. I've probably imaged most of the DSO Nebula out there. (I have great weather most of the year.)

But I wanted more. So, when I ran crossed the AT130EDT, and the folks here who really like theirs, I decided to take the plunge. And I have the mount for it already.

After I got it, I decided I needed a better camera than my ASI1600MM, and I always yearned to go back to my first love, a OSC camera. So, I got an ASI2600MC Pro.

Then discovered I wanted the FR/FC and that got me light years ahead in terms of my already good Astrophotography done my way. The FR/FC shortened my 130mm telescope from 910mm FL to 728mm focal length.

But I found I was still happy. Happy enough to continue striving and with NINA working I did something I never thought I'd do; I got a rotator so I could easily frame my images to get them just the way I wanted them in the collected images.

 

I tried to get an OAG to work for me when starting out 11 years ago. No love. I tried 2 different ones.

So I took my guiding camera and put it on a guide scope and got instant success.

Last year that first guide camera died, so I got an ASI290MM Mini. It has a much higher resolution than the old Orion SSAG camera. With PHD2's Multi Star guiding, the 290 was a win-win camera.

Then I decided to up my guide scope and got an Svbony 60mm guide scope. Glad I did. Many more stars in the field for PHD2 to pick from. And in my opinion, much better guiding over the old stuff.

PHD2 sometimes has as many as 9 guide stars it is following.

[Sacred Heart]

Thanks for the replies. I have spent some time with the seestar in EQ mode and now I think I'm about to pull the trigger and sell it. The one thing that is nice is the in body image processing. But if I use darks and flats with asiair live stacking it's pretty close as far as quality. The ability to guide combined with a cooled larger sensor seems to offset any of the seestar (easiness). Still thinking the seestar is great, but the difference in setup is about 2 minutes. I did a side by side comparison on my evoguide50ed with the starizona ff on the asi533mc and the seestar and there's a huge difference. And it's not the aperture or focal length, it's the sensor and guiding.

Live stacking,   I used to use Sharpcap all the time for DSO imaging, I liked the fact of everything being done as the picture is taken, however I now use NINA and Pixinsight for DSO imaging.  To me, difference is huge.  It is like Polaroid vs 24 hour processing back in the film days.  Just more choices.

 

Joe