9 replies to this topic

[GolgafrinchanB]

I've recently acquired my first refractor telescope and now I'm faced with the challenge of finding something to mount it on. I've come here to ask for some guidance from you all.

 

First off, my primary use case is wide field night vision astronomy with my PVS-14 style image intensifier tube. My secondary use case is as a portable scope for when I can't fit my 10" solid tube dob on a trip.

 

My heaviest loadout is as follows:
Telescope (4.8lb): Astro-Tech AT72EDII Refractor 72mm f/6 doublet
Accessories (4.7lb): Tele-Vue 55mm Plossl with 67mm adapter, GSO Al+SiO2 Mirror Diagonal, .8x reducer field flattener, PVS-14 Image Intensifier Tube, light red dot finder
Total weight: 9.5lb, sometimes a brief 11.5lb with a phone attached for a quick photo

 

I'd quite like it to track. Portable is important to me, but I'm also young and regularly carry my 10" dob around.

 

Budget - $200-$1000 Ideally keeping it below $500, but if the value is good I could go above. This is the budget for mount and tripod combined.

 

The first thing I'm considering is getting a new Sky-Watcher AZ-GTi mount and tripod. They are currently on sale for $400 and seem to match my portability and tracking concerns quite well! I'm wondering how people feel about its performance when occasionally loaded up with the full 9.5 lbs, especially with half of that weight hanging off the focuser.

 

The other thing I'm considering is watching the classifieds and local used marketplaces waiting for a 20-30lb weight capacity mount to show up at a decent price (something that seems to keep popping up as AP folks move to the strain wave mounts). Something like a Celestron AVX or maybe a lighter Skywatcher EQM-35. I'm confident these will do fine with tracking and the load but am wondering how portable they really are.

 

Lastly, there's the bigger strain wave option. This seriously exceeds my listed $1000 budget but solves all my other problems with loadout, portability, and tracking concerns (plus it lets me upgrade in the future) but of course this comes at a rather steep price! Do you think I should consider just buying once now?

 

Thanks in advance for your guidance (see the pun) here!

[Jethro7]

Hello 

I am also a PVS14 user.  the mount set up does not need to be extreme. Because the  nature of the PVS 14 being in real time viewing, you don't really need GoTo tracking to take short exposure images of DSO's with a phone and that opens the door for a variety of usable mounts, such as manual Alt/Az mounts and these will be both cheaper and much less problematic. You just Plunk them down any which way and go. My light weight travel mount consist of a Desert Sky Astro DSV-M and a Benro series 303 carbon fiber tripod and this mount and tripod holds my Tak FC 76-DS and my night vision gear just fine. My medium weight mounts are a Desert Sky astro DSV-2 and a Stellarvue M002C. I could make the good argument for choosing the DSV-2 or M002C over the DSV-M for any future scope upgrades where you may find the need more payload capacity.  

 

HAPPY SKIES AND KEEP LOOKING UP Jethro

 

https://www.desertsk....com/DSV-3.html

 

https://www.stellarv...llarvue-mounts/

 

Desert Sky Astro DSV-M

 

 

Desert Sky Astro DSV-2. Will hold two scopes at once

 

Stellarvue M002C with Altair 152 F/5.9 and PVS14

 

Images 2 second exposures captured by hand held phone 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Jethro7, 17 December 2024 - 09:05 PM.

[scanner97]

Your current uses would be near the envelope on the AZ-GTi, but I'm guessing would be fine if you don't plan to go heavier or do an imaging beyond a quick phone shot.  Someone who owns one will confirm, I'm sure.

 

A next step up would be the Star Adventurer GTi.  Only a bit more expensive, I think you'd find it a better option if you want to be able to do a little more imaging but aren't planning to go heavier than the AT72.

 

Next would be the EQM-35, which would give you a little more room on weight, as well as being a decent option for beginning imaging.

 

If you're mainly doing visual right now, I probably wouldn't suggest a strain wave unless you only want to goto and track.  The swg mounts can run in either altaz or eq, yes, but a lot of guys who only do visual like to slew by hand.  The swg mounts generally don't have clutches so you can't push them around.

Edited by scanner97, 17 December 2024 - 03:55 PM.

[flappah]

Talking from my past experience, I started out with a Nikon D780 and Sigma 150-600mm lens on a Star Adventurer GTi. Even though it is at the limits of the mount it worked quite well. I did quite some imaging of different galaxies and learned the basics with it.
Now it all went south when I decided to go to the ASIAIR route and do guided imaging with it. The setup was waaay too close to the limits of the mount to get some real results. When I went to a 70-200mm lens I got better results. This pushed me over the cliff and I bought an AM5 mount. This. Was. Awesome!!! Guiding worked wonderfully well.
I just recently even ditched the Nikon d780 and went for a ZWO FF80 and 533MC-pro camera and now I finally am getting the results I’ve had in my head.
So the moral of the story probably is, buy the most expensive mount you can afford. If you decide to stay in the 2,5kg range a Star adventurer gti will do. But if you think about going over this buy a heavier mount. In the end you save money. Really.

[GolgafrinchanB]

Reading your responses so far,

 

I guess I hadn't really considered that tracking can come at the cost of manual slewing comfort. This complicates my decision and means I need to soul search a little regarding manual vs tracked.

 

I hadn't heard of Desert Sky Astro before, but they look pretty sweet! I'll definitely be investigating them more!

 

With your combined input considered, I'm now leaning away from a strain wave mount (due to the inability to quickly slew the mount, something I truly love doing on my dob) and away from the mid-range tracking mounts (e.g. Celestron AVX and Skywatcher HEQ5) also due to what seems like a far less pleasant manual experience (heavier and bulkier, EQ can be non-intuitive manually, probably not super easy to work with clutches and may lose alignment).

 

This leaves me between

(a) Skywatcher AZ-GTi for it's ability to manually slew without losing the target as well as tracking for experimenting with "phone"ography as well as possibly one day experimenting with AP

(b) Something in the DSV-M/1/2 range from Desert Sky or a similar product from someone else for the affordable and comfortable manual experience as well as higher payload assuming I go up a bit in price.

 

I'm leaning a bit toward (b) tonight, but am still unsure. More input is always welcome if folks have it!

[scanner97]

I guess I hadn't really considered that tracking can come at the cost of manual slewing comfort. This complicates my decision and means I need to soul search a little regarding manual vs tracked.

This is only the case with strainwave mounts.  Traditional wormgear mounts will have clutches you can release to manually slew, and can also have tracking.  There are plenty of slew and track mounts with better payload and better tracking than the AZ-GTi option.  The catch is the cost.  (And there is still the question of altaz vs eq.)

 

I would say tracking is less important for wide field.  Only really important if you spend a lot of time at high mag on planets, or if you think you are likely to want to try AP soon with somewhat longer exposures.  Going for a less-expensive Desert Skies mount would be attractive if you're mainly interested in DSO visual right now and don't have a strong inclination to try deeper imaging any time soon.

[sevenofnine]

The S/W AZ-GTi might work well for you. I use the standard model with a fully loaded AT80ED and it's fine up to  140x using a  AT 4/82 UWA eyepiece. The scope is set up with a 2" diagonal and both a GLP and RDF. The automatic tracking is very nice! I usually find objects manually using a SynScan IV hand controller. It has very fine speed control from 1-9. The only drawback for you could be the included tripod. It's very lightweight and stable enough for my purposes but many owners upgrade to a more solid tripod. Best of luck to you! 

 

.

 

 

[balcon3]

Most of the answers that you have received so far have suggested AltAz mounts. It's true that they are the simplest mounts to use. But if you want tracking, as you do, things get a bit more complicated. Tracking is most easily and cheaply implemented on an EQ (GEM) mount. In an EQ mount, to track you don't need GoTo or any electronics. You just need a motor on your RA drive that can be run by a small battery pack. There are several small, light EQ tracking mounts available, such as the Skywatcher EQ3, which has a capacity of 12 pounds. The highest quality is probably the Vixen AP, but that is a bit over your price range.

[AaronF]

Reading your responses so far,

 

I guess I hadn't really considered that tracking can come at the cost of manual slewing comfort. This complicates my decision and means I need to soul search a little regarding manual vs tracked.

 

I hadn't heard of Desert Sky Astro before, but they look pretty sweet! I'll definitely be investigating them more!

 

With your combined input considered, I'm now leaning away from a strain wave mount (due to the inability to quickly slew the mount, something I truly love doing on my dob) and away from the mid-range tracking mounts (e.g. Celestron AVX and Skywatcher HEQ5) also due to what seems like a far less pleasant manual experience (heavier and bulkier, EQ can be non-intuitive manually, probably not super easy to work with clutches and may lose alignment).

I have owned a SW AZ-GTi for several years and bought a Vixen AP this year.

I think that they're both very good mounts for their cost (the Vixen AP was half price).

 

The AZ-GTi is great for visual tracking - the object will drift away from the centre but it's easily nudged back into place by the phone app (or a bluetooth joystick connected to the phone)
Loosening and tightening the clutches to manually move the telescope can get tiresome, especially the azimuth clutch: it's easily broken from overtightening. Mine now has a custom-made azimuth clutch which won't break.

 

The Vixen AP is wonderful for visual tracking - connect a 5V USB battery pack or put 4x AA batteries in the compartment inside the declination unit, and it'll start tracking in the RA axis.

The axes have clamps on them to adjust the friction, letting you set it just right so that you can grab the telescope and move it, and it'll carry on tracking when you let go. Fine adjustments can be made with the Star Book One hand controller.

There's no go-to functionality or computer control (unless you buy a Star Book Ten or the wireless module - both are overly expensive) but there's an autoguider port.

It can also be converted to an alt/az mount by adding the base and counterweight from the APZ mount - they're available separately.

 

There's a lot more information about it here: https://reflexions.j...ent/mount/7744/

 

I think that at full price the Vixen AP is a bit expensive, but it can be bought for less (I bought mine in bits and pieces from Bresser, Vixen's European distributor, when I saw them discounted, either refurbished or on sale) if you're not in a rush.

It's a lovely solid mount and a joy to use.

[Astro-Remete]

Hi, SvBony SV225+ZWO TC40, that's about 11 pounds. But it can handle 5" MAK or ES102CF.

Edited by Astro-Remete, 05 January 2025 - 09:11 AM.