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Visual on Mars with a 152 refractor?

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#1 revans

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 01:52 PM

Until recently I'd mostly been absorbed in photographing the planets and trying to get some detail recorded.  I am not very good at it yet, but my best efforts so far have been using 6 to 9.25" SCTs or my 180 mak.  My seeing is infrequently better than 3/5 except on the very occasional, usually very much unexpected, night.  Visually I don't like the amount of contrast on Mars features with these scopes... although the 180 Mak does the best job of this group of scopes. Jupiter is a bit washed out in the SCTs but is also a little better in the Mak. 

 

I have an SVX-140T which is convenient for visual as I can use it on more forgiving mounts than my MYT or G11 (which are great but which come with more complexity in software, polar aligning, setup and takedown all of which eat up more time than simpler mounts).  In spite of this, I usually leave it setup for deep sky imaging. The 140 is a great scope but it really excels at what I bought it for... namely deep sky imaging.

 

I've been nosing around for a scope that I could handle and mount adequately that would be really nice for viewing Mars, Jupiter and Saturn.  I finally decided to get a 152 f/8 refractor with decent apo optics.  There were a few choices including TEC and Stellarvue and I also considered a couple of used Starfire scopes that were available. Being a creature of habit, and liking my SVX-140T... I eventually decided on getting the Stellarvue.  

 

Anyone know what planetary views I can expect when it arrives (as compared to the SCTs and Mak I've been using?  Will I really gain contrast and was the move from a 140 to a 152 worth the extra trouble?  I'm also thinking about eventually buying an ERF (energy rejection filter) and using the 152 for solar imaging with a Quark Chromosphere filter from Daystar.... maybe this summer when it isn't so freezing outside and the sun isn't so low to the horizon most of the day.

 

Rick



#2 Astrojensen

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 02:01 PM

Well, you'll soon find out for yourself. There might even be a few SCT's coming up for sale soon, I suspect. wink.gif

 

 

Clear skies!

Thomas, Denmark


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#3 Safetyman

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 02:08 PM

If the SVX152 is anything like my 150EDL, and it probably is and more, you can expect excellent views. Viewed Mars a few weeks ago in great seeing and the polar region really stood out. I could make out darker and lighter regions on the disk, but the contrast differences were much more subtle than ice cap. That was the first time I had viewed Mars at such high magnifications so I don’t have any other observations to compare it to…but it was outstanding in my opinion.


Edited by Safetyman, 21 January 2025 - 02:08 PM.

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#4 slavicek

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 02:16 PM

With quality refractor sky is the limit (= it's the limiting factor). Last night, when conditions allowed, I could see details in those darker regions of Mars. Polar cap is easy. But you have to harry up because Mars is leaving us soon!



#5 Astrojensen

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 02:37 PM

But you have to harry up because Mars is leaving us soon!

What? First time I hear of this! Where is it going? Alpha Centauri? 

 

 

Clear skies!

Thomas, Denmark


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#6 Jethro7

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 03:01 PM

Hello Rick,

I have a TS Optic 155 C-F APO, that puts up splendid views of the planets. However I find my self preferring to use my newly acquired TEC 140 these nights because TEC 140 is considerably lighter by 15 Lbs. and the views are just as sharp and nearly as bright as the TS155. Mars is as good as Mars gets right now. 

 

YOU WILL ENJOY YOUR NEW APO, WHICH EVER ONE YOU CHOOSE.

 

KEEP LOOKING UP Jethro


Edited by Jethro7, 21 January 2025 - 03:03 PM.

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#7 revans

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 03:29 PM

On Mars with the 6 inch SCT I used last night, I could see plenty of albedo detail on the planet's surface and the larger polar cap was bright and obvious.  But when I replaced the camera with a 4mm eyepiece then the polar cap was obvious but the features on the planet's surface changed from the dark brown the camera gave to a sort of pale muddy yellowish that was hard to distinguish from the reddish or brick red background of the planet.  A filter would have helped, but I would really like a natural view.

 

Anyway, I went for the 152 and I expect to be using it sometime mid to late next month.

 

Rick


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#8 Heywood

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 04:20 PM

Hello Rick,

I have a TS Optic 155 C-F APO, that puts up splendid views of the planets. However I find my self preferring to use my newly acquired TEC 140 these nights because TEC 140 is considerably lighter by 15 Lbs. and the views are just as sharp and nearly as bright as the TS155. Mars is as good as Mars gets right now. 

 

YOU WILL ENJOY YOUR NEW APO, WHICH EVER ONE YOU CHOOSE.

 

KEEP LOOKING UP Jethro

 

Does your 155 show any more planetary or lunar detail as compared to your 140?



#9 slavicek

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 04:45 PM

What? First time I hear of this! Where is it going? Alpha Centauri? 

 

 

Clear skies!

Thomas, Denmark

LOL. Mars size will be smaller and smaller and smaller... fast! So Mars will be soon gone from the visual observer's point of view. Sorry I confused you.

 

However, if you really want to get some "braking news" story then there's a story somewhere on the internet (= it must be true) where they claim Mars will visually get bigger then full Moon!  And, if that ever happens, then someone will indeed end up going to Alpha Centauri, fast.


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#10 Bikeboy60

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 04:52 PM

I have an SVX152T.  I love it.  I had excellent seeing a couple of weeks ago.  I was viewing Jupiter at about 400X.  I could resolve the the moons into tiny disks, and see detail in the various cloud bands, but the thing that blew me away was watching Io transit onto the disk of Jupiter.  I watched it move onto the disk and could still resolve it and see the pale yellow color.

 

This scope has also given me a better appreciation for lunar viewing and binary stars.


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#11 Jethro7

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 04:57 PM

Does your 155 show any more planetary or lunar detail as compared to your 140?

Hello Heywood,

The simple answer is no. My TEC 140 makes me want a TEC 180.

 

HAPPY SKIES AND KEEP LOOKING UP Jethro 


Edited by Jethro7, 21 January 2025 - 04:58 PM.

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#12 revans

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 06:00 PM

I don't think I could handle a refractor larger than a 152 unless maybe it was a doublet and therefore lighter by a few pounds.  There is an Astro Physics 178 f/9 for sale as a used scope at Cloud Break Optics in the state of Washington (I think).  It is going for 10K and has been on the website there for a few days.  I considered it, but reality dawned on me and I really couldn't handle it or properly mount it.  On the other hand, the 152 should be OK for me.

 

Rick


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#13 slavicek

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 06:36 PM

I don't think I could handle a refractor larger than a 152 unless maybe it was a doublet and therefore lighter by a few pounds.  There is an Astro Physics 178 f/9 for sale as a used scope at Cloud Break Optics in the state of Washington (I think).  It is going for 10K and has been on the website there for a few days.  I considered it, but reality dawned on me and I really couldn't handle it or properly mount it.  On the other hand, the 152 should be OK for me.

 

Rick

Wow, now that's tempting!  Refractor aperture rules as you know. I am not sure how heavy is that AP 178 but my TEC 180 is ~40 lb. So if you want to check up how/if you can handle 180 then I have it located near Worcester at this time. PM me if you do.



#14 Jethro7

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 08:43 PM

I don't think I could handle a refractor larger than a 152 unless maybe it was a doublet and therefore lighter by a few pounds.  There is an Astro Physics 178 f/9 for sale as a used scope at Cloud Break Optics in the state of Washington (I think).  It is going for 10K and has been on the website there for a few days.  I considered it, but reality dawned on me and I really couldn't handle it or properly mount it.  On the other hand, the 152 should be OK for me.

 

Rick

Hello Rick,

Understanding your limits as well as planning for the long haul is very important when choosing equipment. It is easy to bite off more than you can chew in this Astro Hobby. There are lots of threads here in the CN archives from folks that have and wind with equipment they don't want to or can't use. The Stellarvue 152, if I looked up the right 152, let's say at 25Lbs with rings and mounting plate attached should not be to difficult if you don't need to lift it too high for a EQ mount or if you are using a tilt in saddle. I may covet a 180mm class scope but that thought will stay a pipe dream. My TEC 140 coupled with a night vision device give me plenty of light. 

 

HAPPY SKIES AND KEEP LOOKING UP Jethro


Edited by Jethro7, 21 January 2025 - 08:48 PM.

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#15 revans

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Posted 21 January 2025 - 09:42 PM

Wow, now that's tempting!  Refractor aperture rules as you know. I am not sure how heavy is that AP 178 but my TEC 180 is ~40 lb. So if you want to check up how/if you can handle 180 then I have it located near Worcester at this time. PM me if you do.

Thanks for the offer but I know I can't handle a scope that big.  A couple of years ago my dog knocked me over and shattered my right shoulder.  Now some arthritis has set in there as well.  I'll do well to handle the 152 :)

 

Rick



#16 RichA

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Posted 22 January 2025 - 12:57 AM

I don't think I could handle a refractor larger than a 152 unless maybe it was a doublet and therefore lighter by a few pounds.  There is an Astro Physics 178 f/9 for sale as a used scope at Cloud Break Optics in the state of Washington (I think).  It is going for 10K and has been on the website there for a few days.  I considered it, but reality dawned on me and I really couldn't handle it or properly mount it.  On the other hand, the 152 should be OK for me.

 

Rick

It may have been up before, a long time before.  



#17 bobhen

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Posted 22 January 2025 - 08:27 AM

I had one of those older Astro-Physics 152mm F9 triplets that you were thinking about. I purchased the scope directly from Astro-Physics back in 1989. Can't say much about the SV 152 or the Astro-Tech 152 EDL. But the AP 152 delivered fantastic views of the planets. Some of my best views of Mars were with that scope. Details on Jupiter's disk were easily seen including the faint festoons hanging from the NEB. Many nights I counted 10-15 alternating belts and zones on Jupiter's disk. 

 

I live in a location where seeing is usually average and the big refractor surprised me with what could be seen, even in average seeing. It's not excellent seeing that separates the men from the boys – it's average seeing. 

 

Good luck.

 

Bob



#18 revans

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Posted 22 January 2025 - 09:31 AM

I had one of those older Astro-Physics 152mm F9 triplets that you were thinking about. I purchased the scope directly from Astro-Physics back in 1989. Can't say much about the SV 152 or the Astro-Tech 152 EDL. But the AP 152 delivered fantastic views of the planets. Some of my best views of Mars were with that scope. Details on Jupiter's disk were easily seen including the faint festoons hanging from the NEB. Many nights I counted 10-15 alternating belts and zones on Jupiter's disk. 

 

I live in a location where seeing is usually average and the big refractor surprised me with what could be seen, even in average seeing. It's not excellent seeing that separates the men from the boys – it's average seeing. 

 

Good luck.

 

Bob

The used Astro Physics I considered was a 178 f/9 and in the end I thought it too large and bulky for me to handle well and so I scaled down my thinking to the Stellarvue 152 f/8 and am hoping to be able to work well with that.  I suppose Astrophysics along maybe with TEC make super premium apo refractors.  I chose Stellarvue for their SVX-140 and now their SVX-152 mostly because Vic Maris who runs the company is so accessible and helpful but also because the quality of the optics and the fit and finish of the instruments is plenty sufficient for me. 

 

Rick


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#19 Bikeboy60

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Posted 22 January 2025 - 12:03 PM

Ugh... The seeing was not good last night. I was lucky to get steady skies on the night of opposition.  My SVX152T that night showed a crisp sharp disk with the ice cap and some light surface detail.  It is crazy how seeing can determine so much for observing planets.



#20 Lumix.guy

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Posted 22 January 2025 - 12:50 PM

Wow, now that's tempting!  Refractor aperture rules as you know. I am not sure how heavy is that AP 178 but my TEC 180 is ~40 lb. So if you want to check up how/if you can handle 180 then I have it located near Worcester at this time. PM me if you do.

I had a 1990-ish AP178 f/9 in a glossy white tube and it only weighed about 28 pounds! For visual, it would have been fine on a G11, but it really benefits from a variable height pier tripod and I made one that was really convenient since the eyepiece height changes a lot from horizon to zenith. I highly recommend the AP178 if you can find one!

 

I sold my minivan and that caused me to downsize from the AP178 f/9 to an AP155 f/7. The loss of resolution was most notable on Jupiter's Galilean satellites. I simply loved how the AP178 frequently showed them as disks of varying sizes, varying brightness and varying color tone with just a UO 9mm ortho. Simply breathtaking. My AP155 f/7 can do that, but not nearly as easily or frequently.

 

Before I downsized, I asked Roland about my 1990's formulation AP178 compared to the newer/improved AP155 optics: Would the AP155 equal the AP178 due to it's improved optical formula? In brief, he said "aperture rules" and the 178 will win. He was right!

 

John


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#21 Jon_Doh

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Posted 22 January 2025 - 01:26 PM

I don't know if your 152 will show more detail or contrast than your 140, but the best improvement I've had on Mars is to use a filter to bring out the details.  Baader's contrast is great for doing that and even their Moon and Skyglow is better than viewing with no filter. 

 

Anyway, I know you'll be pleased with your new 152.  The club where I used to live had two in their observatory and they were excellent.  The club also had a couple of C-14's and almost always folks preferred the 152's provided.


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#22 mikeDnight

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Posted 22 January 2025 - 05:39 PM

 I bought a FS152 around 2007 and it needed a Losmandy G11 as bare minimum to carry it well. I at first tried an SWEQ6 but the scope was grossly undermounted. As for what you will see and what the SV152 scope will show will be dependent on both seeing and your perseverance. Sometimes the seeing will have you wondering if you've made the right decision, while at other times the seeing and the scope will leave you in no doubt you made the right one. At times like that you might need to put your bottom jaw in a sling to stop it hitting the floor. Persistence is key, as the more often youre at the eyepiece the more often you'll experience those fleeting Windows of perfect seeing, which occur even on mediocre nights. 

 Incidentally, my G11 was mounted on a permanent pier in my garden, which made things much easier for me as I only had to carry my tube assembly and eyepiece case outside. A canvas garden chair cover covered the mount and its electronics and was tied around the pier. Nothing ever got wet or even damp even in stormy weather. 


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