24 replies to this topic

[TayM57]

With newer EPs starting to come to market after the COVID pause, (XW 85s, T7's) I was wondering what the logical next EP set from Baader will look like. I'd love to see an improved line of the Morphii with better focal length spacings, better light scatter control, and a consistent AFOV/ER across the entire line. 

 

But will Baader go in another direction, and try to bring to market a EP like the ES92's? Or will they release an EP line like the Delites? 

 

What is in the cards for Baader Planetarium, I wonder? 

[CrazyPanda]

I feel like Morpheus still has a solid value proposition even against the T7s. In practice the AFOV isn't *that* much different save for the 17.5mm.

 

Hyperion could use some TLC. On paper it's a great line that occupies a price tier that not many other eyepieces do. In practice it's not consistent in quality and hard to recommend it.

 

If they could revamp/replace Hyperion and provide a mid-level, $150 ~ 65 degree LER line that is more consistent in quality than the Hyperions, and is a step above the X-Cel LXs / Paradigms, I think that would move some numbers for them.

 

They should also add a 3.5mm Morph, and they should update their Morphs to fix the glare issue with them. Just a better spacer ring design or some blackening. The baffling and blackening they use on their premium safety kerf nose pieces is second to none. They just need to do that for the internals of the Morph.

Edited by CrazyPanda, 13 March 2025 - 02:30 PM.

[SeattleScott]

They might get into the hyperwide game, although it feels pretty competitive right now. Could they do better than XWA for same money? Or as well for less?

[Astrojensen]

I'd like to see them extend the Baader Classic Ortho line with more focal lengths. An 8mm would be particularly nice. 

 

 

Clear skies!

Thomas, Denmark 

[Neanderthal]

A 2" 24mm would be a sweet adition to the Morpheus line, IMO.

Edited by Neanderthal, 13 March 2025 - 03:07 PM.

[TayM57]

The Morpheus line so good, and well received, that I think it deserves a "type 2" line, like TeleVue does with their Naglers. Many types of Naglers, but the name stays the same. I think the same should be true for the Morpheus. The Morpheus type 2s, and so on. 

 

They might get into the hyperwide game, although it feels pretty competitive right now. Could they do better than XWA for same money? Or as well for less?

[havasman]

To me eyepieces are a buyers market with serious indicators that the future will bring shrinkage: aging visual practitioners and the boom in AP'ers. I'm surprised to see new lines coming out at all. The market seems well populated with really great options from hyperwides to minimal glass lines. In many popular configurations, AFOV's from 100/110, 82, 68, 50-ish and ER's long and short, there are multiple high value and $'s-no-object choices. If I was a manufacturer/marketer like Baader I'd keep R&D operating but I'd likely not put a less than absolutely revolutionary new product into this market.

 

The T7's seem likely to suck all the activity out of the luxe end of the new ep market for quite a while. There will be many who just have to have them. I think that different than if a new Baader line were to appear.

Edited by havasman, 13 March 2025 - 03:17 PM.

[TayM57]

A 2" 24mm would be a sweet adition to the Morpheus line, IMO.

Agreed although the design challenges with the 17.5 point to the unlikeliness of this possibility. Come to think of it, there is no 20+mm FL EP with the same characteristics as the Morphii, and I don't count the UFF 30mm. Entirely different characteristics to that one, and I'm not talking about just the AFOV. 

[saemark30]

Baader Classic  set should comprise of 4, 6, 8, 10, 12.5, 16, 25 and 40 mm oculars like the old Zeiss Jena set.

[25585]

Baader are the #1 for binoviewer, and eyepiece accessories like Clicklocks & GPCs. Morpheus eyepieces were designed with binoviewers in mind, hence their slim (for AFOV), and fairly light weight. I use 9s & 17.5s binoing.

 

For binoculars, they could go 2", or wider AFOV perhaps. A binoviewer with a 2" nose would be interesting. 
 

Nagler T7s are in the TV-verse, for those who can afford them. Morpheus (& Long Perng 80 AFOV) are everyperson and the trailblazers the T7s are following, just as (1.25") Pentax XW70s were the LER 70 AFOVs that were followed by Delos. 

Morpheus, LP LERs & ES92s, the Noblex & APM 12.5mm UWA 84 AFOVs, are special in their easy use, easier exit pupil designs. If Baader want to grab some of the more exotic design ideas, longer eye relief 90-100 AFOV picking up where ES stopped. They could add dedicated mini-Barlows as Nikon NAV HWs have.

[Olimad]

I agree with extending the Baader Classic set. 8, 12,5 and 25mm would be nice. A 4mm too (since I sometimes use a 4mm plössl ...) but It would be more limited.

 

Extending Morpheus line, could be a nice option too.

[scotsman328i]

It would be great if they made a Baader Morpheus Mk. 5 zoom. Could they do it? Or still impossible to stretch the FOV out at 20-24mm on it? I have the Baader Hyperion Mk. 4 zoom and love it. 

[RichA]

With newer EPs starting to come to market after the COVID pause, (XW 85s, T7's) I was wondering what the logical next EP set from Baader will look like. I'd love to see an improved line of the Morphii with better focal length spacings, better light scatter control, and a consistent AFOV/ER across the entire line. 

 

But will Baader go in another direction, and try to bring to market a EP like the ES92's? Or will they release an EP line like the Delites? 

 

What is in the cards for Baader Planetarium, I wonder? 

They might want to move away from that rough anodizing that characterizes the Morpheus and the pretty much disliked other Baaders (except for the zoom).  It's a cheapish finish even for a mid-end eyepiece.  TeleVue and ES pretty much set the standard for external finish.

[TayM57]

They might want to move away from that rough anodizing that characterizes the Morpheus and the pretty much disliked other Baaders (except for the zoom).  It's a cheapish finish even for a mid-end eyepiece.  TeleVue and ES pretty much set the standard for external finish.

I agree. Though, anodizing to the level of the ES/TV's may increase the price. I've always felt the Morphii was a notch or two below my other EPs insofar as finish goes, but the views more than make up for it.

 

The very best characteristic of the Morphii are the thin barrels around the eye lens. It makes them quite unique, and lends itself well to the presentation at the exit pupil. This is unmatched by other EPs. I've not seen this in any other EPs.

Edited by TayM57, 15 March 2025 - 12:13 AM.

[Neanderthal]

Lol. I like the satin finish on the Morpheus series. It's durable, not slippery and doesn't show fingerprints.

[rgk901]

I'd take a similar designed 2" to match my set...

I'd wlso take a higher power zoom with similar characteristics... if that zoom can be a sharp as the 4.5 that be fantastic

[Starman1]

I'd take a similar designed 2" to match my set...

I'd also take a higher power zoom with similar characteristics... if that zoom can be a sharp as the 4.5 that be fantastic

Point to another zoom, from any company, with a long focal length longer than 16mm, that has an apparent field larger than 60°.

There hasn't been one in history. 

And the slow sales of the Tele Vue 3-6mm 50° zoom points to the reduced interest in short focal length zooms.

The recent 3-8mm Zoom from Svbony sold well at first, but little in the way of new posts.  Alos, it's <60° at its widest.

To avoid the CA, astigmatism, field stop issues, focusability,  and spherical aberration of most zooms would make a very expensive eyepiece.

KUO tried for 75° in their 7.7-15.4mm zoom, but it ended up 66-67° and it's edging up on $500.  Plus, it won't come to focus in most scopes used as a 1.25".

I'm afraid fixed focal lengths are what is necessary to give the Morpheus-level performance with fields that wide.

[rgk901]

Point to another zoom, from any company, with a long focal length longer than 16mm, that has an apparent field larger than 60°.
There hasn't been one in history.
And the slow sales of the Tele Vue 3-6mm 50° zoom points to the reduced interest in short focal length zooms.
The recent 3-8mm Zoom from Svbony sold well at first, but little in the way of new posts. Alos, it's <60° at its widest.
To avoid the CA, astigmatism, field stop issues, focusability, and spherical aberration of most zooms would make a very expensive eyepiece.
KUO tried for 75° in their 7.7-15.4mm zoom, but it ended up 66-67° and it's edging up on $500. Plus, it won't come to focus in most scopes used as a 1.25".
I'm afraid fixed focal lengths are what is necessary to give the Morpheus-level performance with fields that wide.

Good Sir, seems like there is a lot of negativity from you in various astro wishlists.. something about science/statistics..
... but just imagine if we collectively meditated changing the laws of quantum mechanics, just enough to make a fantastic, short mag, 85 dgeree, completely parfocal 18mm ER light weight/tiny zoom that extends in the barrel not messing up scope position.

let's make it happen!

Edited by rgk901, 15 March 2025 - 05:31 PM.

[25585]

There used to be two Antares Speers-Waler zooms

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[scotsman328i]

Point to another zoom, from any company, with a long focal length longer than 16mm, that has an apparent field larger than 60°.

There hasn't been one in history. 

And the slow sales of the Tele Vue 3-6mm 50° zoom points to the reduced interest in short focal length zooms.

The recent 3-8mm Zoom from Svbony sold well at first, but little in the way of new posts.  Alos, it's <60° at its widest.

To avoid the CA, astigmatism, field stop issues, focusability,  and spherical aberration of most zooms would make a very expensive eyepiece.

KUO tried for 75° in their 7.7-15.4mm zoom, but it ended up 66-67° and it's edging up on $500.  Plus, it won't come to focus in most scopes used as a 1.25".

I'm afraid fixed focal lengths are what is necessary to give the Morpheus-level performance with fields that wide.

See, that’s what I thought, Don. I’d love to see a zoom that can maintain a 68-70 degree FOV across all focal length settings, but had a feeling it couldn’t be possible. 

[SeattleScott]

There used to be two Antares Speers-Waler zooms

If they were that tall to hit 80 AFOV with around 50% zoom range, imagine how massive a 2x or 3x range zoom with 80 AFOV would be!

[CrazyPanda]

Point to another zoom, from any company, with a long focal length longer than 16mm, that has an apparent field larger than 60°.

 

I guess technically the Leica? 60 degrees @ 17.8mm, so therefore slightly wider @ 16mm.

 

 

 

See, that’s what I thought, Don. I’d love to see a zoom that can maintain a 68-70 degree FOV across all focal length settings, but had a feeling it couldn’t be possible.

 

The Leica goes from 60 @ 17.8mm to 80 @ 8.9mm.

 

But if you want a zoom that can maintain ~70+ in longer focal lengths than 17.8, then it would have to be a 3" barrel since the internal zoom components place limits on lens position and diameter.

Alternatively, you could probably get a consistent 70 degree zoom in something like a 5mm-10mm or 6-12mm zoom range.

Edited by CrazyPanda, 15 March 2025 - 08:55 PM.

[TayM57]

Good Sir, seems like there is a lot of negativity from you in various astro wishlists.. something about science/statistics..
... but just imagine if we collectively meditated changing the laws of quantum mechanics, just enough to make a fantastic, short mag, 85 dgeree, completely parfocal 18mm ER light weight/tiny zoom that extends in the barrel not messing up scope position.

let's make it happen!

I see Don as being pragmatic, given his vast knowledge of eyepieces and optical design.

[rgk901]

I see Don as being pragmatic, given his vast knowledge of eyepieces and optical design.

I hope everyone, especially Don, understand I was just being silly

[scotsman328i]

Haha, Don P. is a really good guy. He is a wealth of information. Sometimes he gives me the answers I don’t want to hear, but know I have to because the answers are based in physics, quality and facts. If I have an issue with gear, he’s one of my top go-to guys for information and advice.