41 replies to this topic

[Rigel_10]

I have a tele vue 18.2 delight eyepiece and I've noticed if you concentrate in the center of the view there are six tiny little dots very small, but you can see it clearly when you concentrate on it.

I've switched eyepieces out and it seems to only be the Delight eyepiece... what could it be?
I've used it in three different scopes and it doesn't matter it's not in the scope it's in the eye piece and since there's six little tiny dots I'm assuming it has something to do with each lens from the Delite design and from looking at it, it looks like a tiny flock of birds in a circle in the center of the view, and this of course is during the day, at night I probably wouldn't notice it.

Rotating the eyepiece seems to have no effect either, focusing in or out doesn't really affect it either it's very strange.

The eye piece is clean and only a year old it's a great eye piece but I have noticed in the very center these tiny little circle of black dots.

Thanks for any feedback.

Edited by Rigel_10, 27 March 2025 - 10:55 AM.

[Wolfwatcher]

That's very interesting. I own the same eyepiece and have experienced something similar. Tiny pixels I call them. Now that you've brought this up, I'll check more carefully next time I use it, and try another 18mm I have for comparison. 

 

Thanks for posting your experience.

 

Jett

[Rigel_10]

That's very interesting. I own the same eyepiece and have experienced something similar. Tiny pixels I call them. Now that you've brought this up, I'll check more carefully next time I use it, and try another 18mm I have for comparison.

Thanks for posting your experience.

Jett

Yes, tiny pixels is a good description.

[SeattleScott]

Kind of bizarre. Obviously it isn’t any kind of debris in the eyepiece, otherwise the dots would rotate with the eyepiece. Have you compared to other eyepieces around the same focal length? Obviously there can be issues with seeing the secondary shadow during the day (assuming an obstructed scope), but that should be one dot in the center, not a ring of dots. Honestly I’m thinking this might be floaters, but floaters would move around, they wouldn’t typically stay in place. Have you had eye surgery?

[Starman1]

I have a tele vue 18.2 delight eyepiece and I've noticed if you concentrate in the center of the view there are six tiny little dots very small, but you can see it clearly when you concentrate on it.

I've switched eyepieces out and it seems to only be the Delight eyepiece... what could it be?
I've used it in three different scopes and it doesn't matter it's not in the scope it's in the eye piece and since there's six little tiny dots I'm assuming it has something to do with each lens from the Delite design and from looking at it, it looks like a tiny flock of birds in a circle in the center of the view, and this of course is during the day, at night I probably wouldn't notice it.

Rotating the eyepiece seems to have no effect either, focusing in or out doesn't really affect it either it's very strange.

The eye piece is clean and only a year old it's a great eye piece but I have noticed in the very center these tiny little circle of black dots.

Thanks for any feedback.

Describe the circumstances more completely, please.

Is this when looking at the sky through the eyepiece with no scope, looking at reflections from the eyepiece, looking at daytime targets in the scope, when seriously out of focus, or in focus?

Is this when shining a bright light at the eyepiece or through it?

It's not clear what circumstances show this.

If it's debris in the eyepiece, it can easily be fixed, but if it were debris, it would rotate with the eyepiece.

Do you see it in other focal lengths of Delite?  or do you only own the 18.2mm?

Is this with the black cap on the bottom or with the cap removed? If it's with the cap in place, it could be reflections of the black cap from lens surfaces in strong light.

 

It can be pinned down, but your description of the circumstances is a little too unspecific.

I'm curious about it.  This is the first comment I've ever heard about this in any eyepiece.

[Alex.C]

If the dots only appear when there's lots of ambient light, and don't change their appearance when you rotate the eyepiece, they may just be tiny reflections.

You could try draping a little blanket around your head like an old-time photographer to block out all external light. If the dots persist, there's something else going on.

[jeffreym]

I have a tele vue 18.2 delight eyepiece and I've noticed if you concentrate in the center of the view there are six tiny little dots very small, but you can see it clearly when you concentrate on it.

I've switched eyepieces out and it seems to only be the Delight eyepiece... what could it be?
I've used it in three different scopes and it doesn't matter it's not in the scope it's in the eye piece and since there's six little tiny dots I'm assuming it has something to do with each lens from the Delite design and from looking at it, it looks like a tiny flock of birds in a circle in the center of the view, and this of course is during the day, at night I probably wouldn't notice it.

Rotating the eyepiece seems to have no effect either, focusing in or out doesn't really affect it either it's very strange.

The eye piece is clean and only a year old it's a great eye piece but I have noticed in the very center these tiny little circle of black dots.

Thanks for any feedback.

So, you have the eyepiece in a diagonal?, looking through several different telescopes at a clear blue sky? in the daytime, right?

Rotating the eyepiece does not change the position of the dots (the dots don't rotate with the eyepiece if it is rotated)?

Focusing has no impact?

The underlined items are what remains unclear I think. 

 

This is very odd. . .

 

Jeff
 

[SeattleScott]

Six tiny dots, might this have to do with the lens configuration of an Amici diagonal? Aren’t there six angles? I wonder if it goes away when swapping to a mirror diagonal? Or viewing straight through?

Edited by SeattleScott, 27 March 2025 - 11:46 AM.

[Rigel_10]

The Amici or mirror diagonal makes no difference the spots remain.

Rotating the eyepiece has no effect whatsoever.

Focusing in or out makes no difference.

It only happens in a telescope, I tried it in my telescopes, two were cactiopters and two are reflectors, it's the same in all of them so it's definitely the eyepiece.

There's no debris in the eyepiece.

I only have the 18.2 Delight but I also have a 12 mm Radiant that I compared it with, only the Delite shows the specs. Also used other EPs ...only the 18.2 show the tiny spots.

I do have eye floaters but this is definitely not a floater issue.

If you hold it up to the light there's no specs at all it's only in an optical instrument that they show themselves

I'm asking anyone out there who has the 18.2 to test it in your scopes just point it kind of towards the sky and focus/concentrate on the very center and you might see the black specks I'm seeing?

Thanks

[TOMDEY]

You'll notice that the six little dots become most visible at opposition, exactly five days from now. They will then quickly fade to oblivion... reappearing annually on the same date every year.     Tom

[CrazyPanda]

Rotating the eyepiece has no effect whatsoever.

 

Focusing in or out makes no difference.

 

It only happens in a telescope I tried it in for my telescopes two were cactiopters and a two are reflectors it's the same in all of them so it's definitely the eyepiece.

 

There's no debris in the eyepiece.

 

If doesn't rotate with the eyepiece, and there's no debris in the eyepiece, then it's not in the eyepiece and must be in your eye.

[Rigel_10]

You'll notice that the six little dots become most visible at opposition, exactly five days from now. They will then quickly fade to oblivion... reappearing annually on the same date every year. Tom

That's a good one, Tom, lol
But this is daytime viewing circumstances.
Although, I need to try it on the moon at night, I'm assuming I'll see it there as well. I'll try it when we get closer to first quarter.

[TOMDEY]

Actually --- what's going on is that the uniform bright field and larger exit pupil flooding your smaller constricted eye pupil is interacting with your eye, resulting in narcissistic signature conjugate to your retina. This ghosting interaction will be different for different eyepieces and different observers, some combinations hypersensitized and most not. Me... I'm now rather immune to those effects because I got my eyes fixed "cleaned up" a few years ago. The older you get... the more such phenomena manifest.    Tom

 

PS: I test for the Narcissus Effect using the set up shown here >>> Flood the entrance pupil with an adjustable Lambertian source and critique various eyepieces etc. etc. You will of course notice the blood cells pulsating through your capillaries just above the retina and myriad other interesting structural features in your eye. The opposite/complimentary test uses a miniscule adjustable pupil 50-500 microns in diameter. I also use that test to identify floaters and other structure from the cornea on back. The source conjugate for this test is placed very very close to the cornea --- just a few mm above it.

 

"The Narcissus Effect occurs when a detector inside a optical system sees a reflection of itself, resulting in a dark spot in the center of the image. Additionally, radiation reflected from each surface of the optical system also returns to the detector, affecting the image quality of the system." ~

 

[Part of my work assignment was addressing field-use instruments interaction with the user... for obvious reasons (gun sights, metrology equipment, photogrammetry analyst work stations, etc.). Also various ophthalmic exam instruments design, build, and calibrate.]

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[Rigel_10]

If doesn't rotate with the eyepiece, and there's no debris in the eyepiece, then it's not in the eyepiece and must be in your eye.

That's possible but it only happens on the Delight I have many other eye pieces that it doesn't show any Center spots like this plus it's dead on in the center and does not move, if it was my eye probably be some movement in it like a floater or something? I don't know but maybe it's the onslaught of some eye problem?... but I highly doubt it in this case, I'm thinking the Delight design is six lenses and that's approximately what the little black spots are six of them the best I can tell.

[Highburymark]

No dots or specks in either of my 18.2s.

[jupiter122]

The Amici or mirror diagonal makes no difference the spots remain.

Rotating the eyepiece has no effect whatsoever.

Focusing in or out makes no difference.

It only happens in a telescope, I tried it in my telescopes, two were cactiopters and two are reflectors, it's the same in all of them so it's definitely the eyepiece.

There's no debris in the eyepiece.

I only have the 18.2 Delight but I also have a 12 mm Radiant that I compared it with, only the Delite shows the specs. Also used other EPs ...only the 18.2 show the tiny spots.

I do have eye floaters but this is definitely not a floater issue.

If you hold it up to the light there's no specs at all it's only in an optical instrument that they show themselves

I'm asking anyone out there who has the 18.2 to test it in your scopes just point it kind of towards the sky and focus/concentrate on the very center and you might see the black specks I'm seeing?

Thanks

Maybe it's the same problem that is plaguing your CN posts?

 

[Starman1]

I'm thinking this is somehow related to the scope unless it happens in multiple scopes.
I would call Tele Vue and ask them about it.
Since this is a unique comment, it likely is an issue with an interaction between the observer and the eyepiece, but I don't know what it is.
I wonder if the light level is high enough to yield multiple reflections of the observer's pupil.

[areyoukiddingme]

Do you have other ~18mm eyepieces? It could be your eye showing this effect at a particular exit pupil (though the mix of scopes suggests otherwise).

 

I don't see any dots when using mine in an 80mm F6 refractor (I have a pair for binoviewing).

[CrazyPanda]

That's possible but it only happens on the Delight I have many other eye pieces that it doesn't show any Center spots like this plus it's dead on in the center and does not move, if it was my eye probably be some movement in it like a floater or something? I don't know but maybe it's the onslaught of some eye problem?... but I highly doubt it in this case, I'm thinking the Delight design is six lenses and that's approximately what the little black spots are six of them the best I can tell.

DeLites are 8 lenses as far as I know.

 

I have three 18.2 DeLites. I can try and test them tonight.

Edited by CrazyPanda, 27 March 2025 - 01:47 PM.

[betacygni]

Only thing I’ve experienced somewhat similar is reflections back from my own eyeball off the eyepiece. Not sure this would explain your full situation though. Have you tried wrapping a towel over your head to fully eliminate all ambient light? Do the dots move if you move your head slightly to the side?

Edited by betacygni, 27 March 2025 - 01:58 PM.

[SeattleScott]

I'm thinking this is somehow related to the scope unless it happens in multiple scopes.
I would call Tele Vue and ask them about it.
Since this is a unique comment, it likely is an issue with an interaction between the observer and the eyepiece, but I don't know what it is.
I wonder if the light level is high enough to yield multiple reflections of the observer's pupil.

Apparently the same thing happens in all four of their scopes.

If it doesn’t rotate, it seems it has to be the eye, or some reflection onto the eye lens like you indicate. But why only with the Delite? It happens in multiple scopes, so it doesn’t seem to be related to a particular magnification or exit pupil.

[betacygni]

But why only with the Delite? It happens in multiple scopes, so it doesn’t seem to be related to a particular magnification or exit pupil.

My guess is the delite has enough eye relief to let in an ambient light source reflecting off his eye and into the eyepiece.

Edited by betacygni, 27 March 2025 - 02:02 PM.

[Rigel_10]

I'm thinking this is somehow related to the scope unless it happens in multiple scopes.
I would call Tele Vue and ask them about it.
Since this is a unique comment, it likely is an issue with an interaction between the observer and the eyepiece, but I don't know what it is.
I wonder if the light level is high enough to yield multiple reflections of the observer's pupil.

It happens in multiple Scopes I have and I use all different eye pieces I have and it's only the Delight that shows the little black spots in the middle and when I say it doesn't move but the effects of the atmosphere kind of make it look like it's rotating almost the spots but they stay in the middle they don't move anywhere.

I have an ES 14/82 that is closest to the 18.2 and no spots, only the 18.2.

I don't have any fancy photographic equipment just the phone but when the moon comes out maybe I can get a shot of it where we could actually see it on an image but in my eye I can see it plain as day, but only on the 18.2
I really don't know what to say 🤷‍♂️

[SeattleScott]

My guess is the delite has enough eye relief to let in an ambient light source reflecting off his eye and into the eyepiece.

Honestly, that’s the only thing that makes sense to me.

[Rigel_10]

SeattleScott... I just tested it by putting a hoodie jacket over my head completely covering any light and it didn't affect anything I still see the black specks in the middle.

Actually I'm thinking of contacting tele vue and possibly sending the EP to them so they can do some tests with it because it's hard to explain on the internet like this, you have to see it and I'm definitely seeing something. And once you see it you can't unsee it as they say.