32 replies to this topic

[Sean Cunneen]

I got a call from ACH yesterday about this Marketplace ad and in no time I was roped into driving across Illinois to check out this collection of scopes...

https://www.facebook...are/1R5K8U52qW/

I was able to identify the Byers mount and we strongly suspected the blue tube might be an AP 178.

We wanted to see what the scopes' provenance was and to see if there was anything else. When we got there, the scopes were as pictured, wrapped in plastic. Fair warning. The plastic is deteriorating and has left a film on both scopes. These have been here a while.

They were owned by an Optician named Kreischer of Kreischer Optics. He passed and his wife moved out of state. A family friend is taking care of clearing out the storagespace where the scopes are located.

[Sean Cunneen]

Here are some pics of the brass scope. 6"f15, coated achromat. Brass finderscope. In a huge sturdy hinged box. No name on the lens. The lens cell and dewshield are clearly ATM. 

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[Sean Cunneen]

Here is the front end of the Blue one ...

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[MisterDan]

Blue scope indeed appears to be an Astro-Physics 7-inch f/9 Starfire.

 

The brass bad boy is likely custom.

 

Best wishes.

Dan

[starman876]

I thought the starfire lenses all had writing on the lens cell.   Also astro physics on the focuser.  

[ccwemyss]

The early focusers with the cast housings did not say Astro-Physics. I'm not sure when they started engraving the front lip of the lens cell. The pre-Starfires didn't. This might not be a Starfire, as they also started putting the logo on the dew shield around then. There were some pre-Starfire triplets larger than 6" (up to 8") for custom orders. So it could be one of those. The writing on the edge of the objective will be the best way to confirm that it is an AP and if so, what model. 

 

Chip W. 

[Sean Cunneen]

I am trying to get permission from the family to come back and take the few shield off as it's attached via screws and with all this new info, I am going to have to be really careful!

[CHASLX200]

I thought the starfire lenses all had writing on the lens cell.   Also astro physics on the focuser.  

Naw not on my 6" F/9 Blue tube and focuser was a old cast deal.

[ccwemyss]

In the Craigslist thread, bobhen has identified the brass refractor as a Cheshire Eagle (which used Jaegers optics), and posted an ad showing it with the Byers 58. He also noted that the finder on the blue scope looks like a UO 8x50, which is what AP was recommending in the early days, and that the guide scope looks like one of their imported 80mm models.

 

https://www.cloudyni...2#entry14096419

 

Chip W. 

[CHASLX200]

The blue OTA is on the black mount. The brass OTA is the Cheshire. The silver/grey mount is the

Byers 58. The ad says that the black mount is an AP 704. 

 

From the Company Seven Website...

"In the early 1980's Astro-Physics introduced their first German Equatorial Mounts, the robust Models 704 and 800 series".

 

So, if the ad is correct, the black mount is an AP 704 one of AP's first large mounts and is probably over 40 years old. 

 

Bob

704 was before the AP800.  I saw a 58 mount once and it looked nice.

[jragsdale]

Has anyone asked the seller how real the price is in the ad?

$1234 is not a price, it's a place filler. Just like 123456789 is. Sounds like Sean advised a price when he visited? But not sure what that would be.

[Steve_M_M]

I strongly believe the brass Cheshire was mine.  There should be a post on CN about it sometime between 2002-2003 (I think these are archived on CN).  I sold it in 2005/2006 while in IL.  We were moving to CA at the time.  It was sold with no dewshield    Lens is not original as I broke it, but fairly easy to replace with another Jaegers 6"f15

 

This is the only brass Cheshire I have ever seen in 50+ years in the hobby.

Edited by Steve_M_M, 22 April 2025 - 12:06 PM.

[harbinjer]

Has anyone asked the seller how real the price is in the ad?

I messaged and asked.  It's not too far from me, but unlikely to be "emergency road-trip" pricing. 

[Steve_M_M]

I found a couple pictures on an old hard drive...

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[jragsdale]

Bingo!  The brass Cheshire was my scope from many years ago.  I Sold it in IL in 2005/6.  The lens is not original.

If they originally had a Jaegers lens, what did you put in it?

[Steve_M_M]

If they originally had a Jaegers lens, what did you put in it?

It was sold with the badly damaged lens

[ccwemyss]

The blue tube sure looks a lot like a bigger version of this 5" Starfire in an ad just posted by Gary Hand.

 

https://www.cloudyni...e-vintage-1988/

 

Chip W.

[Sean Cunneen]

Thanks to Bobhen, Steve and Chip for all the back info! I did talk to them about pricing, I don't want to go into to much detail as I gave them a lot of information, but they were not selling yesterday, I think they want anyone interested to see the scope in person before talking $$$$. I told them the blue scope could be rare and worth thousands or ATM and worth $800, and not to assume it was rare until we see a label or verify a serial number. I won't say anything more here because I wouldn't want any of you to make a large cash offer only to take the lens out and find out it's a DKD in an AP suit. Especially considering the owner ran an optics manufacturer, he very well could have made the optics himself. If they let me take it apart, you all will be the first to know!

[CHASLX200]

That 7" AP is a easy 10k.

[jragsdale]

That 7" AP is a easy 10k.

If it's an AP lens. That's the question currently.

[CHASLX200]

If it's an AP lens. That's the question currently.

I don't see why it would not the real deal neal. My 6" looked just like it.  But i guess sending it to AP would be the only way to know. If the lens is in good shape then it should be fine.  Wished one would pop up by me but maybe wait a year or so as all my money is going into walls and floors and such.

[jragsdale]

I don't see why it would not the real deal neal. My 6" looked just like it.  But i guess sending it to AP would be the only way to know. If the lens is in good shape then it should be fine.  Wished one would pop up by me but maybe wait a year or so as all my money is going into walls and floors and such.

Likely is, but should have markings on the lens perimeter which would be easy to see. Use a laser to see if its a doublet or triplet, air spaced or oil spaced. A really interested buyer could DPAC it to see if it has the optical pedigree of an AP.

[Random2310]

I want to preface this by saying I am an amateur amateur astronomer. I am sure most of you have owned more scopes than I have even looked through.

 

I visited the seller this morning, very nice guy who is selling on behalf of an estate. I took some pictures and have attached them to this post and created an album. I should have taken more but I was really too excited, overstimulated, and tired from my early morning drive. I traveled down there because I am interested in the 6" F15. Man, it is one thing to read about 6" F15 refractors and to see pictures but to see one in real life, it blew me away. 

 

Just my 2 cents, the Blue telescope looks like this photo of an AP178 f9 Starfire posted by CN user etsleds in Post #55 in another thread and also this photo of an AP178 f9 Starfire posted by JeffB in Post #8 also in a different thread.

 

Seller is not in any rush to sell, I encouraged him to take his time and do his research and also to reach out to AP to see if they could locate an invoice, shipping information, something that could help prove provenance.

 

You guys who visited yesterday are doing God's work making sure widows get fair-market price for their scopes. I think that's really awesome. 

 

The seller told me a funny story; whichever one of you saw the box marked "Zygo", became superexcited, only to find a box of Beauty and the Beast paintings, hahahah, I wish I could've seen your face in that moment.   

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Edited by Random2310, 22 April 2025 - 07:55 PM.

[RichA]

Thats the 80mm guidescope, meade rg 20mm erfle, uo 12mm konig. Nice 

[CHASLX200]

Likely is, but should have markings on the lens perimeter which would be easy to see. Use a laser to see if its a doublet or triplet, air spaced or oil spaced. A really interested buyer could DPAC it to see if it has the optical pedigree of an AP.

Mine was a 3 lens deal and very top heavy. I had to have a 5lb wight for back weight to keep up the saddle on a G11.