72 replies to this topic

[Airstrike]

Can someone explain the 3 point polar alignment I don't understand it.   More specifically  the "select scope point".  I don't getba

Basically in a nutshell its kinda like if you imagine GPS when satellites pinpoint your position the more satellites you have the better the accuracy of telling you where you are on earth for triangulation when using maps on your phone

 

So when you set your scope up and calibrate it by doing the twisting spin dance as it completes it knows where you are standing on earth by the "long and lat" data it collects and is important so when you do the 3 point star polar alignment , the scope aims in the sky and takes 1 image then moves takes another then moves and takes one more , and each shot the scope looks at the star patterns in each of the 3 images this is known as plate solving 

once the 3rd image has been taken then the onboard computer of the scope tells the app on how you need to adjust your scope as in which direction has to be changed so you have basically the up and down left and right numbers try and get it close to Zero as possible in green once youve made these adjustments then the scope is as good as polar aligned  ie pointing at polaris the north star

 

also the new feature lets you select the angle you wish to start the 3 pic star alignment off , that feature is handy if you have the sky blocked directly above you by part of your house, balcony or tree or even if there is say some clouds right above you were you cant see stars so selecting another spot in the sky makes polar alignment easier

 

it is super handy if for some reason you cant see polaris cus your own vision is blocked due to houses or trees ect ect 

Edited by Airstrike, 17 May 2025 - 10:32 AM.

[Slimtannor]

Thank you. I knew what 3 point alignment was, actually,  but the "select scope point" threw me off   as  i was unsuccessful in getting a polar alignment last night. I need to troubleshoot that problem now. It may be the new update wont work with my tablet for whatever reason. I know I can't capture the Sun with my table but can with my phone.  Android thing i guess.

[Airstrike]

Thank you. I knew what 3 point alignment was, actually,  but the "select scope point" threw me off   as  i was unsuccessful in getting a polar alignment last night. I need to troubleshoot that problem now. It may be the new update wont work with my tablet for whatever reason. I know I can't capture the Sun with my table but can with my phone.  Android thing i guess.

another tip when you do the alignment and you got those number close to zero as possible DONT click the button just under the numbers as you have already done the alignment otherwise it will keep telling you to align over and over , so only do it best you can once then all you need to do is literally backbutton out the the PA page altogether and go to select what target you want to image and you should be good to go

 

the sun and moon seem to be tricky customers when slewing to them alot of farting around to get them on screen , think most folk have this ? i know i do
i use the the skymap in the SS app to locate the sun or moon and select a star closest to its position and that get me in the ball park somewhere close then just use the joypad to move to the brightest part untill it comes into view

Edited by Airstrike, 17 May 2025 - 11:49 AM.

[bradhaak]

I just did the flats in about 2 minutes, sitting at the kitchen table. This link is only for android and I am apple. But I realized you don’t need an app. Just Google “white screen” and you get a bunch of websites. I used the first one, www.ledr.com.

 

I had the Seestar app open on my tablet and used my iPhone for the white screen, which is large enough to cover the lens. I set the brightness slider to about 80%. Worked like a charm on the first try.

 

My question is this. Now that I have captured flats, if I go back and stack some frames previously captured in the Seestar, will it apply the flats? I am talking about using the Seestar Deep Sky Stack. Or does it have to do it while enhancing? You can see I know next to nothing about all this.

I did it the old-school way.

 

I set the S50 on the kitchen counter and manually pointed it toward a recessed light in the ceiling. Then I placed an old white t-shirt over the lens and captured the flats on the first try.

 

After that, I updated the S30 and repeated the process. Again, success on the first try.

[WillR]

another tip when you do the alignment and you got those number close to zero as possible DONT click the button just under the numbers as you have already done the alignment otherwise it will keep telling you to align over and over , so only do it best you can once then all you need to do is literally backbutton out the the PA page altogether and go to select what target you want to image and you should be good to go

 

the sun and moon seem to be tricky customers when slewing to them alot of farting around to get them on screen , think most folk have this ? i know i do
i use the the skymap in the SS app to locate the sun or moon and select a star closest to its position and that get me in the ball park somewhere close then just use the joypad to move to the brightest part untill it comes into view

Yea, I have been having that issue where I polar align, get the numbers down to .1 to .3, and then go in and check it and it is now telling me it is many degrees off. Once I had this happen, where it was 9 degrees off in azimuth. So I got the numbers back down into the green, although I was pretty sure it wasn’t pointing at Polaris. (Can’t see Polaris, but I can see the pointers) Sure enough, I checked it a third time, and now it was off by the same amount in the opposite direction, meaning maybe it was pointing correctly the first time? 
 

So what gives here? Shouldn’t you get the same reading every time?

 

One issue I have is having enough sky for the Seestar to do its thing. How many degrees does it swing through when it polar aligns, 60? The five points to choose in the new firmware don’t help because I am hemmed in by trees on all sides. 

(I can rarely image any target more than an hour or two before it is in the trees). I wonder if this is contributing to my inability to get consistent polar align ment readings?

 

So as you said, if I polar align and then simply leave the alignment page, how do I know if I am actually aligned?

[bradhaak]

Hey Will - I've found that if I go ALL the way back out to the settings screen and restart the EQ alignment from scratch, it starts over, relocates the three alignment stars and let's me check my alignment. 

[bradhaak]

Go back to the Advanced Settings page and start the alignment from scratch. That should force it to go back to the beginning, redo the entire process, and tell you where you're at.

[WillR]

Hey Will - I've found that if I go ALL the way back out to the settings screen and restart the EQ alignment from scratch, it starts over, relocates the three alignment stars and let's me check my alignment. 

You mean if I exit the EQ alignment page, then go back in and start over, I will get a different result than if I just hit the check polar alignment button again? That makes no sense. You may be right, but I don’t get it. A glitch in the software?

[SRSteve]

I have the same result but find that doing the EQ polar alignment a second time can result in a better % of image success (less dropped subs) than if I just do it once. I read somewhere that it might be due to backlash in the gears the first time but have no real explanation.

[sanford12]

With the update decided I needed to make sure the Sky Watcher tripod was level if I was going to try 30 second shots. Sure enough the bubble level on the tripod was pretty far off. Got it level add scope and run deviation. Was 3.6 off so moving the scope a good bit. The thing I noticed is since the scope was level now while slewing to Polaris the latitude which was .01 off didn't change where before if you were moving to Polaris you'd have to adjust latitude. Not now. Makes since really. If your not moving in a flat plane but at a slight angle it will affect your other adjustment. Now for the next thing. Had never had luck with 30 second shots before leveling the tripod. Tonight it's shooting 30 second shots no problem. Don't believe those that tell you tripod level isn't that important with the Seestar. 

[Airstrike]

I have the same result but find that doing the EQ polar alignment a second time can result in a better % of image success (less dropped subs) than if I just do it once. I read somewhere that it might be due to backlash in the gears the first time but have no real explanation.

interesting .. supposed to be clear again tonight south coast UK so i will try this out 

[geoffl]

I tried the 60s option, and found that I was getting reasonable success with M81/M82. When I moved to M86, more to the west, most of the subs were discarded, and after a while I got a banner message to "select a shorter image duration". Perhaps the 60s option is best reserved for targets closer to the celestial poles.

 

Geoff

[Airstrike]

I tried the 60s option, and found that I was getting reasonable success with M81/M82. When I moved to M86, more to the west, most of the subs were discarded, and after a while I got a banner message to "select a shorter image duration". Perhaps the 60s option is best reserved for targets closer to the celestial poles.

 

Geoff

i think you will find the "select shorter image duration " is very likely due to blue hour leading upto sunrise so you dont over expose your images and it gives you alittle more time imaging as the sky gets brighter by using lower exposure times, 

ive not had my seestar S50 long enough to see what exposures i can get over the June period which is like blue hour all night   , most likely be 30sec will work if not then 20sec should be fine

Edited by Airstrike, 18 May 2025 - 06:05 AM.

[mbits]

I found getting a good eq alignment was easy with my MSM wedge before this update.  After the update my fine tuning numbers are jumping all over the place. I hope something was up with my tripod (hadn't moved it in days) as it was impossible to chase the ever changing numbers.

Edited by mbits, 18 May 2025 - 06:54 AM.

[former lurker]

I noticed the changing numbers too. How can the numbers change even when I don't go anywhere near the scope? The tripod hasn't changed or moved. This seems to be a new issue with this new firmware.

On another topic... How does the sky know you have something new? Sucker holes! The sky shut down before I could get any real images!

[WillR]

I noticed the changing numbers too. How can the numbers change even when I don't go anywhere near the scope? The tripod hasn't changed or moved. This seems to be a new issue with this new firmware.

On another topic... How does the sky know you have something new? Sucker holes! The sky shut down before I could get any real images!

I’m glad I’m not the only one. But it’s not the new firmware. It’s been doing it to me since before the latest update. Why the numbers change is a mystery.

[geoffl]

i think you will find the "select shorter image duration " is very likely due to blue hour leading upto sunrise so you dont over expose your images and it gives you alittle more time imaging as the sky gets brighter by using lower exposure times, 

ive not had my seestar S50 long enough to see what exposures i can get over the June period which is like blue hour all night   , most likely be 30sec will work if not then 20sec should be fine

I was imaging during the (as defined on the "Clear Outside" site's details for my location) short "Astro Dark" period, and the sky was a good, clear, black. I had been watching the app's time display, and it was frozen at 6.00 for several tens of minutes, with a few "Star Trails" messages.

[former lurker]

My numbers are bouncing around by several degrees. I know its not my mount!

That never happened before this update. Is it possible to go back to the previous firmware and app to test this?

[Bill Jensen]

Just chiming in here as well. My attempt post app/firmware upgrade failed to track properly, after several attempts. I may delete the app from my phone and re-load it if it is clear tonight. Previously the EQ mode worked ok, fewer dropped frames than alt az, but not great. 

[Airstrike]

one thing ive found with the new update is when im shooting south i can now do my plate solving selecting the lower position in the new alignment arc in settings and because i do my 3 point align there i get more frames as its closer to the targets im imaging

i know this helped me when i was using my Skywatcher HEQ5pro mount using NINAs 3 star align and i would always polar align in a clear section of the sky as close as i could get to my target and i found this was on the money everytime i was getting 2min exposure at 600mm without guiding

so in short if you can aim your PA as close to your target as possible using the new polar aligning arc give it a try , nothing to lose

 

Seestar before the update would polar align only to the zenith so when you are imaging a target low in the sky like the rise of M16 ect just over the horizon that is a huge gap between the alignment zenith and the target area

Edited by Airstrike, 18 May 2025 - 10:51 AM.

[former lurker]

Airstrike.

Thanks! That's really good information. I'll try it next time out. I had no idae about that.

Is it possible to polar aligne on your target?

[Airstrike]

only along the meridian line so basically north to south which is forced to to the nature of polar alignment   ((il stand corrected if i am wrong on that ))  so i target the closest point on that line to my target as posible when selecting a dot on the new polar alignment arc

so for instance becuse the blue horse head is rising from the horizon i would select the mid to lowest dot on the arc pointing south making sure no object are blocking the view // if i was imaging M51 the whirlpool galaxy then i would select the dot in the middle that points upwards for the zenith as M51 is close to it

last night i was imaging a small section of the blue horse head reflection nebula and got over 3hrs of suscessful subs for about 4hr imaging all at 30sec each 

 

it works for me , others may have other ways of doing it , but its the joy in astrotogging experiment nothing to lose ,

 

1min expos are a work in progress atm 

Edited by Airstrike, 18 May 2025 - 11:45 AM.

[birdleggs]

Why not do it from the city?

[groom]

Just chiming in here as well. My attempt post app/firmware upgrade failed to track properly, after several attempts. I may delete the app from my phone and re-load it if it is clear tonight. Previously the EQ mode worked ok, fewer dropped frames than alt az, but not great.

Did you adequately tighten the quick release plate onto the Seestar when setting up? If it is too loose, the mount will not track properly from the weight of the Seestar causing it to slip and rotate. Could be as simple as that as I did it myself the other night. As soon as I took the Seestar with the quick release plate off the wedge and tightened the plate onto the Seestar and started again, it worked fine.

Edited by groom, 19 May 2025 - 05:01 PM.

[Tim1343]

If since this update you are finding the latitude seems way out, and the numbers are bouncing around, you need to recalibrate the level sensor. I had the same issue and someone on the ZWO forum suggested this and it works. Was getting really frustrated at the crazy readings EQ setup was throwing out, recalibrated and now all good again.