74 replies to this topic

[brentwood]

I have had my old Starliner 12" for about 45 years. On deep sky, it is stunning, but on planets, the Moon and close doubles, not so much. BUT a few years ago when we had forest fires all over the west that led to most stars disappearing, we had the very best view I have ever had of Mars! I was blown away. I have never seen so much detail on a dead still image on my highest mag. I quickly whipped it around to look at Saturn and Jupiter in the West. What would these look like with air this still!  Oh no! they were behind the tree!  This has not been repeated. 

[Tony Flanders]

There really needs to be a better way of dealing with these fires.

You should take this up with the Big Guy Upstairs.

It's a delusion popular in post-industrial society that everything is potentially subject to human control.

[Procyon]

The good news is there's some heavy rain landing right on top of that entire specific area on Saturday. As if someone up there ordered for it to land right on target. Check out the rain radar on Windy, pretty amazing the way it'll come in from the west at full speed, swirl over the target than drop it all on it.

Edited by Procyon, 05 June 2025 - 06:40 AM.

[Russell Swan]

“There really needs to be a better way of dealing with these fires.”

 

There is but no one will acknowledge the big elephant in the room. 

Edited by Russell Swan, 05 June 2025 - 07:25 AM.

[MeteorBoy]

You should take this up with the Big Guy Upstairs.

It's a delusion popular in post-industrial society that everything is potentially subject to human control.

 

There's so much we can do..., early fire-detection satellites, smoke jumping teams and fire-proof roofs to start with.

 

The only plane designed for fighting these fires (the CL-215) has been out of production for many years despite the world-wide here's-my-money demands for it.

 

Canada doesn't even have national forest-fire fighting, training, equipment, or inter-provincial standards or any dedicated fire teams.  It's not even a profession like city Fire Departments are.  We even let these fires burn through the winter only to have these same fires burn through communities in the summer.

 

There's so much we can do.  Not only is this a fire problem but smoke affects the breathing health of hundreds of millions of people.

 

I can't believe that letting thousands of homes burn is somehow acceptable.

Edited by MeteorBoy, 05 June 2025 - 07:59 AM.

[aneeg]

The smoke has now crossed the Atlantic and can be seen high in the atmosphere even here in Norway.

 

Arne

[scopewizard]

There's so much we can do..., early fire-detection satellites, smoke jumping teams and fire-proof roofs to start with.

 

The only plane designed for fighting these fires (the CL-215) has been out of production for many years despite the world-wide here's-my-money demands for it.

 

Canada doesn't even have national forest-fire fighting, training, equipment, or inter-provincial standards or any dedicated fire teams.  It's not even a profession like city Fire Departments are.  We even let these fires burn through the winter only to have these same fires burn through communities in the summer.

 

There's so much we can do.  Not only is this a fire problem but smoke affects the breathing health of hundreds of millions of people.

 

I can't believe that letting thousands of homes burn is somehow acceptable.

https://en.wikipedia...Canadair_CL-415

 

And soon the CL-515.

 

As for forest firefighters, Alberta and other western provinces have a specific funded programs and crews trained every year prior for fire season.

 

Your statements are not accurate. Do a little research before making this kind of comment.

Edited by scopewizard, 05 June 2025 - 08:30 AM.

[mountain monk]

Everyone is partially right. Yes, there are things we can do, yes, somethings are beyond our control, yes, there is a huge elephant in the room, and yes, we cannot talk about the elephant here. After many years, wildfire smoke has emerged as a major subject on Cloudy Nights.

 

Dark, clear, calm skies.

 

Jack

[The_boots]

Good old Smokey the Bear has been advising us about personal responsibility in fire prevention for decades, but we don't seem to listen. To a certain extent, forest fires are not entirely unnatural, but it's a shame we are still at a point where we need to talk around the obvious instead of planning how to fight it 

Whatever the case may be, those discussions don't change the fact that there are people suffering. There are many things that we can't directly affect today, but I like to think there are things we can.

I do think it's weird that the Canadian government matches funds donated to the Red Cross. Are they suggesting if not enough people donate, the government won't help Red Cross efforts? It just seems odd to me. 

I just hope that it helps someone. Prayers are free, but shelter and safety aren't.

[mountain monk]

I went through the Yellowstone fires of 88 and often watched them from the summit of the Grand Teton. After they were over, one lesson was loud and clear: once the reach a certain size and ferocity they cannot be stopped. Some places can be protected, like Old Faithful, with great effort, but in general the fire will follow where the wind and fuel loads takes it. I always compared to an attack by a grizzly—you have to stop the bear before it reaches you, because after it reaches you you have no control. An old client of mine was badly mauled by a grizzly—nearly 400 stitches and a new face. He was a big strong guy and an ultra marathon runner, but he said the grizzly tossed him around “like a robin with a worm.” It’s similar with wildfires—they can’t be allowed to increase in size. In my opinion that’s where we need to focus our efforts.

 

Dark, clear, calm skies.

 

Jack

[Pixeltim]

 

 

I can't believe that letting thousands of homes burn is somehow acceptable.

Idk, California seems perfectly fine with it. Crazy.

[Amazed]

I noticed the change Sunday morning is SE Michigan.  

It has been bad here too all week.

We are under a smog alert all weekend for those with respiratory issues.

[The_boots]

I noticed the change Sunday morning is SE Michigan.  

It has been bad here too all week.

We are under a smog alert all weekend for those with respiratory issues.

Yeah, it's been completely impossible to see anything other than the moon all week.

[vsteblina]

I went through the Yellowstone fires of 88 and often watched them from the summit of the Grand Teton. After they were over, one lesson was loud and clear: once the reach a certain size and ferocity they cannot be stopped. Some places can be protected, like Old Faithful, with great effort, but in general the fire will follow where the wind and fuel loads takes it. I always compared to an attack by a grizzly—you have to stop the bear before it reaches you, because after it reaches you you have no control. An old client of mine was badly mauled by a grizzly—nearly 400 stitches and a new face. He was a big strong guy and an ultra marathon runner, but he said the grizzly tossed him around “like a robin with a worm.” It’s similar with wildfires—they can’t be allowed to increase in size. In my opinion that’s where we need to focus our efforts.

 

Dark, clear, calm skies.

 

Jack

The Forest Service just announced a return to the 10:00 am policy of 1911.  That is not a misprint.  It is 1911.  

 

The priority is to put out every fire prior to 10:00 am on the next day after discovery.  It will be interesting to see if this has any impact on the severity of fire seasons.  Limited resources are still limited resources.

 

It appears that all Forest Service employees will be expected to accept fire assignments.  That is a change from the policy of the past few decades where Forest Service employees could turn down fire assignments.

 

The fire season forecasts are for a very ugly fire season in the US.  Starting any day now.

 

“There really needs to be a better way of dealing with these fires.”

 

Yes, but there is but nobody is listening to the recommendations of professional foresters. 

 

So we go on following lawyers and politicians while the public forests are burned and ecologically changed for thousands of years.

 

https://www.californ...-paper-camp-70/
 

Edited by vsteblina, 06 June 2025 - 07:49 PM.

[Refractor6]

 Already fully set for another bad one here in Canada  {already started...no kidding} . Where I live we are under a heat warning till the middle of next week. First time such warnings in place this early for June in these parts in my memory.

 

 Welcome to new normal......

Edited by Refractor6, 06 June 2025 - 07:59 PM.

[payner]

The Forest Service just announced a return to the 10:00 am policy of 1911.  That is not a misprint.  It is 1911.  

 

The priority is to put out every fire prior to 10:00 am on the next day after discovery.  It will be interesting to see if this has any impact on the severity of fire seasons.  Limited resources are still limited resources.

 

It appears that all Forest Service employees will be expected to accept fire assignments.  That is a change from the policy of the past few decades where Forest Service employees could turn down fire assignments.

 

The fire season forecasts are for a very ugly fire season in the US.  Starting any day now.

 

Yes, but there is but nobody is listening to the recommendations of professional foresters. 

 

So we go on following lawyers and politicians while the public forests are burned and ecologically changed for thousands of years.

 

https://www.californ...-paper-camp-70/
 

Exactly. While fire is a natural part of the landscape in many regions/areas, this natural mechanism that results in greater diversity and reduced fuel sources has long been suppressed. To the detriment of the very thing many say (unknowingly) this suppression is good for, healthy forests and ecosystems. Nothing could be further from the truth. It is to the detriment of the forest and the many forest animals dependent on natural fire ecology. This suppression is glaring in the diversity rich Southeastern U.S., and has imperiled many of these co-dependent species.

[mountain monk]

And it's not over. Hotshot just reported that one fire grew 50,000 acres in 6 hours. Yep, I think we are in for a grim summer.

Dark, clear, calm skies.

Jack

[Bill Weir]

And it's not over. Hotshot just reported that one fire grew 50,000 acres in 6 hours. Yep, I think we are in for a grim summer.

Dark, clear, calm skies.

Jack

Three big fire merged.

 

Bill

[Dave Mitsky]

https://apnews.com/a...5733cffb06df41f

[MrsM75]

Yep, agreed with you Sir OP.

 

This to me is a personal hobby, the outcome of the "collective" is more important. Like you I also pray for them and their safety. Because it could be you or me in their shoes instead. Me not stargaze for few weeks or few months is fine. 

 

We do get fires here in California too, so it not like we don't know.

 

Please be safe.

[vsteblina]

Here is the update on US fire resources being sent to Canada.

 

https://thehotshotwa...-air-tanker-and

 

It sounds like there are more in the pipeline.  

 

The quote "the Great Migration North" has begun is telling.  Fire season is here in the lower elevations of the western US.  Hopefully, we will not be in triage mode, deciding which fires are worth fighting and staffing and which fires will be let go until more resources are available.

 

The reason that American, Canadian, Mexican, and Austrialian firefighters can work together is the ICS (Incident Command System).  

 

Worth reading if you are at all interested in emergency response organization.

 

https://en.wikipedia..._Command_System

 

Here is the history of ICS....https://www.emsics.com/history-of-ics/.  Notice how long it takes to implement a new system of emergency management.

 

In 2004 President Bush mandated the use of ICS for all emergency response incidents.

[Refractor6]

  I was at a breakfast this morning where a member from our local fire department from the boonies was in attendance and I asked him what he thought about this years fire season due to our earlier than usual heatwave event at the moment. 

 

His answer was it depends on how many crazies/pyromaniacs come out of the wood work this year. He went on to say some of the big fires in Canada right now have been started on purpose by arsonist or by crazies starting fires as a "make work" program in their area...we truly do live in crazy times...

Edited by Refractor6, 07 June 2025 - 12:33 PM.

[PKDfan]

I learned recently that they charged somebody with intentionally lighting one of the Saskatchewan fires.

THAT boggles my mind.

Mother Nature is ferocious occasionally, but in a good way, as a normal wildfire is Great for managing forest undergrowth and some Pine trees actually require a fire for their seeds to be spread.

The complete lack of consequences that some sociopaths wreak havoc with in unconscionable.

I can't say what should be done with 'people' like that or i'd get permanently booted from CN.



Lance
Rain Rain come again Skies

[Amazed]

We had rain most of the day Thursday. That night we had a short window of clear sky's. The Friday we had haze come back in during the day reducing the distance one could see. I never saw anything quite like that. We went up north from Detroit 100 miles. A bit better now but we will see what happens tonight

[The_boots]

We had rain most of the day Thursday. That night we had a short window of clear sky's. The Friday we had haze come back in during the day reducing the distance one could see. I never saw anything quite like that. We went up north from Detroit 100 miles. A bit better now but we will see what happens tonight

Let me know how it is! I'm West of Detroit, but it's been hopeless for the last week. I totally missed any clear skies!