82 replies to this topic

[Refractor6]

Try these apples. The unbelievable part is that this isn't hot yet - for here. 

  I hear you...and no thanks...

 

 

 The point is well taken but FOR THESE PARTS....highs like this aren't the normal temperatures seen at this time of the year...what fun!

[George N]

Here in Arizona the temperatures get so hot that it can degrade synthetic materials. Things like plastics, nylon gears, rubber gaskets, electronic capacitors, etc...

 

When the temps hit 100, it's only a matter of a few days before it's 108 - 115 degrees.  During July and August, now sometimes in September, the temps go as high as 112-118 . That's material destroying temps......

I can remember texting back-n-forth from NY to an Arizona friend when we were both doing solar observing/imaging - he was complaining about it being 'difficult' to stand out in the sun for too long at 108 degrees. Meanwhile, I had a heavy coat on and a breeze in the face made me thing my eyelids were gonna freeze to the eyepiece!

 

While I have done 'solar' in air temps of 95 F or so - the rare nights in the 70's means --- mosquitos - and humidity so thick that..... everything dews up before it's even dark! << but the moose are too hot to be moving around and the bears figure they can just let you die from insect bites before eating you! >>

 

Equipment wise - my main temp concern is cold, not heat. While something like a no-electronics Dob or binoculars are just fine at 10 F, many geared mounts are not. It would have to be something like 'the comet of the century' to get me to risk GoTo slewing with an expensive GEM at temp's much below 20 F -- and then cringing as the gears squeal trying to move fast at those temps. Back in my 'younger days it didn't bother me. My Obsession 20 has been so frosted up that it turned pure white - on more than one cold clear night. The 'real problem' was the frosted up ladder and those cold eyepieces!

Edited by George N, 10 June 2025 - 10:42 AM.

[12BH7]

Frosty ladders - now that sounds like fun waiting to happen.

 

We have an old saying here in Arizona that we try to tell tourists.  It's not the heat that will take you out - it's the sun.

 

Sitting under the sun on a typical day in Arizona the temps are not 108-110. It's more like 120 -130 in the sun. The AIR in the shade is 108.

 

I've tried doing solar and I just can't bring myself to being out there long enough to get into it. 

Edited by 12BH7, 10 June 2025 - 11:19 AM.

[Kefka1138]

Agree with the approach 12B - no way I would leave my instruments outside this time of year. Thankfully, my rig is portable enough to remain stowed indoors year round. 

 

As an aside, did you catch the clear skies last weekend in your area? The skies on Friday and Saturday were very nice in Gilbert, despite the moon. 

[Starman1]

Jealous.

For the last 6 weeks here, the low clouds and fog have come in just before darkness.

We've had maybe 2 clear hours at night in that time.

I did get one night in the mountains last month, but my patio scope and binos haven't seen clear skies since.

I'd accept hot or cold at this point.

[dustyc]

Try these apples. The unbelievable part is that this isn't hot yet - for here. 

Yeah, but look at all those yellow balls! Not a cloud in sight! For a whole week!!

[DirtyRod]

My gear has survived the last two summers here in Phoenix under 365 Telegizmos covers. Last year, I was pretty worried about those 115-118 days but even my Mele 4C survived all summer. Prior to that, I did pack up my gear and bring it in when the temps started to reach 110 but thankfully both rigs rode out the summer. I rarely use hand controllers so those stay in the house but I have lost several 3D printed parts so I only go for metal now. Under the covers, everything has survived until around 10PM when it's cool enough to begin imaging. 

[Jon Isaacs]

100 degrees at night? I guess I won’t be trading my cloudy northeast for sunny Arizona. I’ll take fewer clear nights. 
 

Here in the base of mountains, if it doesn’t get below 70, I consider that a warm night. We’ve pretty much done without air conditioning altogether until recently, and now may need it a few nights or weeks at the height of summer. Most nights it dips into the 60s and the attic fan draws to cool air into the house.

 

In the southwest, night time temperatures directly correspond to altitude.  Phoenix and Tucson are relatively low altitudes, Yuma is near sea level. They're hot at night.

 

Prescott and Flagstaff, they're at 5000-7000 ft, they're much cooler both day and night.

 

Our place in the high desert is at about 4000 feet, most summer nights I'll be wearing sweat pants and a sweat shirt underneath snow mobile overalls and my heavy winter jacket, thermal socks and insulted boot.  In July and August, the average lows are 56°.  

 

El Centro is about 50 miles to the east, about 60 miles west of Yuma and below sea level. Like Yuma, It's very hot at night in the summer.

 

Jon

[12BH7]

The last week has been so hot and hazy that I have no regrets packing up my main scope. Besides, it gives me time with my little 8" SCT. It's actually "fun" to use being so portable and light weight. 

[12BH7]

In the southwest, night time temperatures directly correspond to altitude.  Phoenix and Tucson are relatively low altitudes, Yuma is near sea level. They're hot at night.

 

Prescott and Flagstaff, they're at 5000-7000 ft, they're much cooler both day and night.

 

Our place in the high desert is at about 4000 feet, most summer nights I'll be wearing sweat pants and a sweat shirt underneath snow mobile overalls and my heavy winter jacket, thermal socks and insulted boot.  In July and August, the average lows are 56°.  

 

El Centro is about 50 miles to the east, about 60 miles west of Yuma and below sea level. Like Yuma, It's very hot at night in the summer.

 

Jon

The last week or so the temps in the low desert, which for me is 1700 feet above sea level, are well in the 105's. So my wife and I started doing our short hot weather hikes up on Mt. Ord and atop the Four Peaks. At an elevation of about 6000 feet. This will only last another week or two before the temps up there are well near 100 degrees. 

 

When we're up on top of those mountains we often find Hohokam Indian artifacts. Stone tools, sherds, maybe an old structure. It's amazing that 700 - 1000 years ago those ancient Indians did the same thing to beat the heat by going up that same mountain. 

[DirtyRod]

I guess I've gotten used to it over the last 5-6 years in Phoenix. When it gets into the 110+ during the hottest months, the temps don't get down to under 95 until about 10PM which is where the fans in my cameras can maintain a 0C set point. Between July and Sept, I just plan for all my imaging sessions to start at 10PM.

[12BH7]

I guess I've gotten used to it over the last 5-6 years in Phoenix. When it gets into the 110+ during the hottest months, the temps don't get down to under 95 until about 10PM which is where the fans in my cameras can maintain a 0C set point. Between July and Sept, I just plan for all my imaging sessions to start at 10PM.

Same here, my sessions don't start until around 10pm. 

 

It's not the heat that bothers me, but the sun. So at night I'm perfectly fine. People that don't live in this type of climate couldn't understand how you could be comfortable in 100°.  I can't hike in it but I do like it.  As for off roading I have to limit that as well. Only because getting stuck in the desert with that heat could be deadly. 

 

And again, as for my more expensive gear I feel safer putting it in the air conditioned house. I'm at a point where if my 12" LX90 mount fails I would have to make some serious hobby changing decisions. Like replacing the mount for $3k that I really don't know if I want to deal with. Or finally do that downsizing I've been blabbering on about for years. A failed mount would push that decision.

[DirtyRod]

A failed mount would push that decision.

Thats my opportunity for a 10Micron so maybe that's why I'm rolling the dice. 

[rfcooley]

Temps over 100F. Yup!

Temps below 0F. Yup!.

Wild horses, snakes, mountain lions, coyotes, ill tempered Elk, bears,  Yup! 

Elevations from 5000ft  to 10,000ft. Yup! 

At the house 20.3 Mpsas average.

30 minutes or so away 21.5 Mpsas or better.

24Hr entertainment, lodging and food. Yup!   In case the weather makes a sudden change. It happens.

 

Welcome to Northern Nevada's, Great Basin High Desert.Region. If you don't like the weather?  Wait a few minutes it will change!  May be for the better, May be for the worse. That's Nevada!

 

I do seem to be able to use my equipment all year round though. So never had the experience of having to pack it away.

 

Clear Skies, Never Lose the Wonder

 

Rf

[DSO Viewer AZ]

Just catching up on this thread. I live here in Phoenix, and leave my 10" Dob outside all the time. I would never put it in direct sun, liable to melt / warp plastic components during the hot months, and as everyone who has lived here for a bit knows, sunlight on anything metal is a blister or worse waiting to happen. But in the shade I have had no trouble at all. I have been doing it for years. When monsoons comes I put it in a shed built for it. Outside of that I leave it out and view year round. I get up around 3am regularly and view till sunrise. That is the darkest it gets in the heart of the big city. Then roll it 15ft to shade again. It allows me a setup time of about a minute. At that time of the morning even when we get to 120+ during the day, its not to bad that early. I enjoy viewing with basketball shorts and flip flops as compared to big coats and cold gear. Very few biting bugs and very steady skies. My dark sky location is south eastern AZ at 4600 ft. Its high desert, nice, and usually 10-20 degrees cooler. 250 miles away from home to get to real dark skies. About a hundred miles east of Tucson. That's a long way to go for dark skies, but they are worth it!

[Jon Isaacs]

The last week or so the temps in the low desert, which for me is 1700 feet above sea level, are well in the 105's. So my wife and I started doing our short hot weather hikes up on Mt. Ord and atop the Four Peaks. At an elevation of about 6000 feet. This will only last another week or two before the temps up there are well near 100 degrees. 

 

When we're up on top of those mountains we often find Hohokam Indian artifacts. Stone tools, sherds, maybe an old structure. It's amazing that 700 - 1000 years ago those ancient Indians did the same thing to beat the heat by going up that same mountain. 

 

It's 350 miles from Phoenix to San Diego on Interstate 8.  In the summer months when it's 95° at night in Phoenix, it's 75° in San Diego during the day 

 

Summer weeks, the Interstate 8 has a lot of "zonies" coming to join us for the weather and the beaches.

 

Jon

[12BH7]

My summer time scope is basically a Dob mount with a SCT on it. A simple PUSH TO but with a Nexus Pro DSC and encoders. It's simple, light weight and easy to use. Its kept in the garage and out of the sun. 

 

I really like going out late, which is now 11pm for me, and seeing the summer night sky. I usually don't get out a lot in the summer so those nights are special for me. 

 

My main dark sites now are the Four Peaks area.  It's dark but not as dark as it used to be. Also the Four Peaks used to be isolated. Now it's crawling with a few party people and others that are up to no good.

Edited by 12BH7, 12 June 2025 - 07:34 PM.

[152ED]

At the house 20.3 Mpsas average.

30 minutes or so away 21.5 Mpsas or better.

24Hr entertainment, lodging and food. Yup!   In case the weather makes a sudden change. It happens.

 

Welcome to Northern Nevada's, Great Basin High Desert.Region.

 

I do seem to be able to use my equipment all year round though. So never had the experience of having to pack it away.

 

 

Rf

 

That sounds awesome.  I'm thinking of relocating there (as a rancher, not a rioter!).  Ooodles and noodles of cheap grassland and huge open spaces.
 

[George N]

OK - you "desert dwellers" -- tell us residents of the dank, swampy, wet forests of the East the real story of any *actual* damage sustained by astro equipment (or cameras or computers or.....) from leaving it out in the desert sun at 100+ degrees.

 

Our equipment in the Northeast *does* experience such temps when -- we leave it in a vehicle with the windows up << altho I try to remember to 'crack' a window or two open when stopping for lunch or similar on a trip to say a star party or my lakeside camp. I made sure my big Dob transport trailer has a manual opening air vent in the roof for those days I have to close it up out in the sun full of gear. >>

 

So -- "Where's the beef?" - no theory - who has had an actual C-8 or Dob or binoculars or..... melted into a puddle after sitting out in the desert sun for a day or a week?

 

Maybe we should try an experiment? Someone in the Southwestern deserts rig up a cheap dummy scope using some plastic parts, plywood, hardware store tubing -- cover it with a plastic or cloth and leave it "out there" for a week or two. Does it die, or survive unharmed?

[DSO Viewer AZ]

Hey George, This is a great idea, I think I can do one better. I have a "loaner scope" that is already beat up and don't really care if it survives. I will take the scope and put in direct sun with a cover for a week. I think I know how this result will be. My guess is that it will likely be just fine. As direct sun is the real threat. Then, I will keep it in direct sun for a week. No shade, direct sun all day. My guess, still works, but with plastic finder being warped. I will keep the thread posted. Sounds like a fun experiment! Supposed to hit 112+ on Sunday with really high UV. 110 the rest of the week. In a month or so it should be around 115-120, we can test then as well if it survives the initial onslaught. I will start today.

 

I have already had computers, pagers, and other electronics left out on accident warp and twist and ruin in the summer sun. Never in the shade. That one is confirmed. But happy to try a real scope with finder.

[DSO Viewer AZ]

Ok, here it is. A celestron Powerseeker 114eq. I gave this to my friend to start to learn astronomy. It actually was my first scope. He has since moved to an 8" Dob. This guy was on his patio for the last 3 years already. So it is the perfect tester. Not a tear shed. lol

I put it under a blanket, as I don't have any other cover. There is no rain expected in the foreseeable future, no clouds either. This is from his patio, and should get direct sun 1st thing in the morning until very late in the day. Todays high 106 degrees. 

Day 1.

[DirtyRod]

Ok, here it is. A celestron Powerseeker 114eq. I gave this to my friend to start to learn astronomy. It actually was my first scope. He has since moved to an 8" Dob. This guy was on his patio for the last 3 years already. So it is the perfect tester. Not a tear shed. lol

I put it under a blanket, as I don't have any other cover. There is no rain expected in the foreseeable future, no clouds either. This is from his patio, and should get direct sun 1st thing in the morning until very late in the day. Todays high 106 degrees. 

Day 1.

Very cool. I feel like I should be playing Taps or something. 

[12BH7]

OK - you "desert dwellers" -- tell us residents of the dank, swampy, wet forests of the East the real story of any *actual* damage sustained by astro equipment (or cameras or computers or.....) from leaving it out in the desert sun at 100+ degrees.

 

Our equipment in the Northeast *does* experience such temps when -- we leave it in a vehicle with the windows up << altho I try to remember to 'crack' a window or two open when stopping for lunch or similar on a trip to say a star party or my lakeside camp. I made sure my big Dob transport trailer has a manual opening air vent in the roof for those days I have to close it up out in the sun full of gear. >>

 

So -- "Where's the beef?" - no theory - who has had an actual C-8 or Dob or binoculars or..... melted into a puddle after sitting out in the desert sun for a day or a week?

 

Maybe we should try an experiment? Someone in the Southwestern deserts rig up a cheap dummy scope using some plastic parts, plywood, hardware store tubing -- cover it with a plastic or cloth and leave it "out there" for a week or two. Does it die, or survive unharmed?

I will post a few picks of various things that the heat has killed in my garage.  FYI the heat isn't a one day event. It's about 4 months of 108° consecutive days. Throw in about two to three weeks of 115-118° days. But what really is hard on synthetic materials (and electronics) is the arid low humidity of 5%-8%. This is a slow long term dry baking like condition that eventually weakens plastics and nylon parts. As well as drying out capacitors in electronic gear. 

 

Also I do want to remind you that I do leave my 8" SCT OTA out. It's the mount, parts and electronics I don't want out there. But since the LX90 is a one piece deal, it all comes inside. 

Edited by 12BH7, 13 June 2025 - 08:23 PM.

[rfcooley]

OK - you "desert dwellers" -- tell us residents of the dank, swampy, wet forests of the East the real story of any *actual* damage sustained by astro equipment (or cameras or computers or.....) from leaving it out in the desert sun at 100+ degrees.

 

Our equipment in the Northeast *does* experience such temps when -- we leave it in a vehicle with the windows up << altho I try to remember to 'crack' a window or two open when stopping for lunch or similar on a trip to say a star party or my lakeside camp. I made sure my big Dob transport trailer has a manual opening air vent in the roof for those days I have to close it up out in the sun full of gear. >>

 

So -- "Where's the beef?" - no theory - who has had an actual C-8 or Dob or binoculars or..... melted into a puddle after sitting out in the desert sun for a day or a week?

 

Maybe we should try an experiment? Someone in the Southwestern deserts rig up a cheap dummy scope using some plastic parts, plywood, hardware store tubing -- cover it with a plastic or cloth and leave it "out there" for a week or two. Does it die, or survive unharmed?

GeorgeN

 

We have done just that at the observatory. We placed 2 C8s with the original fork mounts on wedges a Meade LX200 !0" and C9.25 on a CGX and left them out for 2 years covered with  only TeleGizmos covers out on the open air viewing deck. Snow, rain, heat, winds. The Orange tube C8s survived just fine. The Meade  LX 200 OTA and fork mount survived  One fork mount was damaged due to vandalism not weather.  The C9.25 OTA survived just find however the CGX did not. It developed a plethora of electronics problems, sensors, main board etc...etc.  We thought that the CGX might not survive. None of the Celestron mounts survive long even when stored in the observatory telescope room which does stay at  or below ambient temperatures. The room is not temperature controlled. The telescope room is a large roll off roof design. The roof splits in 1/2 one section goes to the east the other goes to the west and each section weighs close to 2000 Lbs and driven by large electric motors and chain pull system. It does have ventilated filtered fans on each end that can be turned on but rarely are. Instead we will crack the roof about 6 inches during hot weather over 100F+ if necessary. It has 3 isolated piers at this time it is configured with 2 C14s. One XLT the other an Edge FastStar equipped on ME mounts. The 3rd pier is a Takahashi C400 on a 10 Micron 4000 HPS II. 

 

So to answer your question. We have extensively tested various telescope OTAs on the open air observing deck in conditions of Snow, wind, rain and heat and left them there for as long has 2 years with little problems at 5000' elevation.  The mounts that survive the best are the Losmandys G8s and G11s on permanent piers on the open deck.  We have a member that is a retired professor that maintains 3 Losmandy G11s on the rear deck of his home and has done that for 10 or 15 years with weather resistant covers.  He recently donated his oldest G11 to the observatory. We sent it to Losmandy and they fully upgraded the mount for $1500 and looks new.  The mount works as well has our other, newer Losmandys for visual work. We have not tested it for AP yet. But most of the G11s guide at .0.3 to 0.7" regularly and there is no reason for this upgraded 20 year old mount, stored outside and covered with a weatherized soft cover to do the same with regular maintenance which they all receive. That is part of my volunteer job at the observatory. I am the maintenance and reconfiguration  "monkey" along with a couple of other volunteers. 

 

Perhaps I should write up a report on the details and what our experience was.  Never thought of that.

 

Clear Skies, Never Lose the Wonder

 

RF

[Jon Isaacs]

OK - you "desert dwellers" -- tell us residents of the dank, swampy, wet forests of the East the real story of any *actual* damage sustained by astro equipment (or cameras or computers or.....) from leaving it out in the desert sun at 100+ degrees.

 

Our equipment in the Northeast *does* experience such temps when -- we leave it in a vehicle with the windows up << altho I try to remember to 'crack' a window or two open when stopping for lunch or similar on a trip to say a star party or my lakeside camp. I made sure my big Dob transport trailer has a manual opening air vent in the roof for those days I have to close it up out in the sun full of gear. >>

 

So -- "Where's the beef?" - no theory - who has had an actual C-8 or Dob or binoculars or..... melted into a puddle after sitting out in the desert sun for a day or a week?

 

Maybe we should try an experiment? Someone in the Southwestern deserts rig up a cheap dummy scope using some plastic parts, plywood, hardware store tubing -- cover it with a plastic or cloth and leave it "out there" for a week or two. Does it die, or survive unharmed?

 

George:

 

I think I get what you are saying and I agree with the gist of it. As long as it's not operating, heat does not damage electronics, plastics do not melt.  Dry is good, no mold, no condensation on the optics nor inside the mounts.  Besides all that, clear skies, no mosquitoes... 

 

But all is not well in the dry southwest when it comes to storing telescopes outside.... Wind and dust..  They're the reasons I will not leave my Dobs outside for extended periods of time.  Dust is everywhere, it gets into everything, covers only slow it's progress down... 

 

Jon

Edited by Jon Isaacs, 14 June 2025 - 10:32 AM.