28 replies to this topic

[rhannequin]

Hello everyone,

 

Apologies in advance if (and it’s probably the case) this question has already been asked many times, it's sometimes difficult to search for the word “planetary” on a forum with so many years of history.

 

I’m not a beginner astronomer, but not highly experienced either. I've been lucky enough to enjoy my ES 12" at some events and outings over the past four years, it’s been an absolute visual treat.

The only downside is that, living in the inner suburbs of Paris, those outings are difficult and rare.

 

I want to be able to do astronomy almost all year round. I’m well aware that, given my location, I’ll be limited to the Moon, the planets, and the Sun, but that’s already quite good. What matters now is being able to observe as often and as easily as possible.

 

In a few months, I’ll be moving into a high-up apartment with a beautiful south-facing balcony (not a large one, 1.2 meters length). I want to take advantage of these next few months to save money and treat myself to a new instrument dedicated to planetary observation. Can you help me find the right one?

 

Here are my criteria:

    Budget: $4000 excluding eyepieces (I already own a few)

    Use: Visual only: Moon and planets, possibly the Sun if possible. If it supports astrophotography then great, otherwise nevermind, I mostly want to do visual.

    Mount: Equatorial for comfort, and possibly motorized for even more convenience

    Maintenance: Low. I enjoy making some adjustments, but I’m not particularly handy

 

My budget is flexible. I really want to treat myself with this purchase and ensure I can enjoy observing from my balcony for years to come. I’ve been saving up for some time already. I mentioned €4000 to show that I’m willing to invest in quality equipment. Owning a fancy car isn’t my thing, what excites me is having an awesome telescope.

 

Thank you all! I’m open to any constructive feedback if I’m off track.

[hyiger]

 

Thank you all! I’m open to any constructive feedback if I’m off track.

A 10" Dob with a PiFinder or maybe a Celestron Edge 925 on an ZWO AM5 mount. A full-on EQ mount with counterweights might not fit. I think eventually though (this is how it worked for me) you'll want to get into astrophotography. So the mount is super important. Moon, Sun and planets are fine in an urban environment but DSO (except for double stars and globulars) is going to be tricky. 

Edited by hyiger, 13 June 2025 - 05:15 PM.

[Asbytec]

Having lived in a big city with an apartment balcony, my first question is do you have access to the roof by elevator or stairs? Or is observing from your balcony your plan? I'd recommend the roof if easily available.

 

In either case, I'd probably go with a modest 80mm to 100mm refractor, something a little more grab and go than a large reflector you already have. Since you have a generous budget, get a good one with a driven altaz mount. 

 

Loading a large scope and accessories in an elevator to go up to the roof or down to the parking area can be dissuasive to observing. You have to make several trips and "hold" the elevator. Get something relatively easy to carry or set up on a cramped balcony.

 

Some form of goto is desirable due to bright city skies. Star hopping is difficult. 

Edited by Asbytec, 13 June 2025 - 06:25 PM.

[Tulloch]

Why not a Celestron Evolution C9.25"? You mention an eq mount for "comfort", but an Alt/Az mount like the Evolution is a breeze to set up and use compared to an eq mount. No counterweights, no craning your neck in weird positions, no meridian flips. The 9.25" is the sweet spot between "too big" and "too small".

 

I use one of these for my Planetary AP, but it's just as easy to use for viewing. Get some nice ultra-wide angle (>80^o ) eyepieces either side of 10mm focal length, so you can see the planet features but also the far off moons. The Baader Contrast Booster filter is great to see the detail on the planets.

 

Then when you get tired of just looking at the planets, the Evo C9.25" is a great scope for imaging, you can see some of my images taken with this setup at the top of the Planetary AP FAQ here.

https://www.cloudyni...d-january-2025/

 

Andrew

[havasman]

While Dallas would never be confused with The City of Lights, my particular location is as bright as Jardine de la Tour Eiffel as my neighborhood has won their war on darkness so I understand part of your problem. I would like to suggest a slightly different configuration and a wonderful scope for your needs. I suggest a 4" doublet ED refractor on an alt/az mount. Comfort and simplicity is the hallmark of that configuration and it will serve as a grand planetary/lunar observing tool from a small-ish platform such as your balcony with a fairly limited observable field. Adding a computerized finder will enable observations of a range of satisfying objects from a city center such as star clusters and double/multiple/colored stars which you will observe in push-to mode, a very convenient method in which the original finding is computer directed and retention of the object in the field is accomplished via pushing the scope along by hand. It is very easy and quickly becomes second nature. 

 

This scope would be tremendous  -  https://www.teleskop...-objective-9868

 

I have smaller and larger scopes of very similar configurations and they are my most used, enjoyable and most reliable telescopes.

 

The best mount might be this Rowan AZ75 with encoders and Nexus DSC computerized finder - https://www.teleskop...s-dsc-pro-16792

I have its big brother the AZ100 for my larger scopes and it is a dream to use in push-to. ALL of my telescope mounts are enabled by the Nexus DSC system whether they are push-to or full go-to/track.

 

From the city my experience is that simple is GREAT. Smaller refractors on alt/az mounts are as simple and convenient as it gets. There are many fine options in today's market and I hope that you will find one that works very well for you.

Edited by havasman, 13 June 2025 - 07:06 PM.

[Jethro7]

Hello rhanniquin,

There are different ways to approach your situation. You can aquire an SCT of at least a Celestron C8 class or a nice doublet APO of around 80mm something like a Takahashi FC 76 DS  and a nice mount like a ZWO AM 5. These mounts are very light and strong and the Views through a Tak are sublime. IMHO, A refractor would lend its self to Imaging better than either the SCT and especially the Dob. I certainly enjoy my Bortle 8 views of the moon and bright planets with my Tak 76 but the caveat is, the aperture of the SCT or Dob will be appreciated. The choices of gear can get complicated and most always will be a give and take situation. With that being said, it might be better to completely seperate the Astronomy Genres of viewing and Imaging with two different sets of gear. 

 

HAPPY SKIES AND KEEP LOOKING UP Jethro

Edited by Jethro7, 13 June 2025 - 07:06 PM.

[jupiter122]

If you’re viewing from a bright city, particularly from a balcony that’s only 1.2 m in length, and your goal is to view the moon, the planets, and the sun, I definitely wouldn’t recommend a 10” Dob, and a 9.25 inch SCT might be overkill. You just aren’t gonna be able to take advantage of the aperture. I’d recommend a 4 inch refractor or a 5 inch Mak on something like the AM3 or AM5, or HAZ31 mount.

[sevenofnine]

Since you're on a balcony and just want a go-to type scope for SSO's then why not a 5"-6" Mak? Plenty of power and light gathering for those objects. My Orion Apex 127 is very compact and so easy to set-up and use. Good luck with your choice! 

 

.

Edited by sevenofnine, 13 June 2025 - 08:02 PM.

[LostInLEO]

First of all welcome to CN 

 

Having lived in a big city with an apartment balcony, my first question is do you have access to the roof by elevator or stairs? Or is observing from your balcony your plan? I'd recommend the roof if easily available.

As @Asbytec mentioned it would help alot to know your logistics (accessibility, where are you planning to store gear, are you able to leave tripod (+mount) outside over day etc.).

 

One mount option worth looking into may be either  AZ-EQ5 or AZ-EQ6. It would give you flexibility of using it in AZ mode for visual and EQ for astrophoto. It is not the easiest to move around, but having substantial weight to it may be quite nice feature to have when observing from a balcony (less wobble due to breezy weather). Some retailers in Europe offer it for quite attractive prices. And they can also be frequently found as second hand.

 

Regarding the telescope you have already got few great suggestions. Having used SW Mak 180 in a city area views were sometimes underwhelming to say the least (poor seeing + air eddies inside OTA)...to the point it was hard to see main belts on Jupiter. If you want to pair planetary with solar an ED or APO refractor would be the way to go in my opinion. For solar it is well worth getting Herschel prism instead of solar filter.

 

Definitely make sure OTA has dual speed focuser tho.

[Tulloch]

If you’re viewing from a bright city, particularly from a balcony that’s only 1.2 m in length, and your goal is to view the moon, the planets, and the sun, I definitely wouldn’t recommend a 10” Dob, and a 9.25 inch SCT might be overkill. You just aren’t gonna be able to take advantage of the aperture. I’d recommend a 4 inch refractor or a 5 inch Mak on something like the AM3 or AM5, or HAZ31 mount.

Here's what's possible from a balcony in the bright lights of Paris with a 300mm Mewlon.

https://www.cloudyni...lcony-in-paris/

 

I don't think you should worry about overkill with a 9.25"...

 

Andrew

Edited by Tulloch, 13 June 2025 - 09:11 PM.

[jupiter122]

Here's what's possible from a balcony in the bright lights of Paris with a 300mm Mewlon.

https://www.cloudyni...lcony-in-paris/

 

I don't think you should worry about overkill with a 9.25"...

 

Andrew

The original poster specifically said that they were only interested in visual viewing. The link you submitted is a stacked and heavily processed image that isn’t even remotely like what someone would see with the referenced scope with visual only viewing . Aperture overkill is very much a concern with bright city view viewing.

 

Tim

Edited by jupiter122, 13 June 2025 - 10:07 PM.

[therealdmt]

Welcome aboard, rhannequin

 

There are balconies and then there are balconies — how wide is yours and how high is the railing or wall surrounding it? As you will be aware from owning and using your 12" Dobsonian, those are naturally mounted down low and, unless raised on a platform, would be unsuitable for a balcony with a typical safety wall or railing. Meanwhile, an equatorial mount takes up a bit of room both on the balcony and for storage inside the apartment, especially if you leave the counterweights on (and if you don’t leave the counterweights on, then that increases inconvenience).

 

So regarding mount type, personally, I would go for a simple, fully manual alt-az mount. The planets and the Moon do not require GoTo — just look out from your balcony and there they are right in front of you. However, if tracking is important to you, which it may well be for planetary, then an EQ mount can make sense (some alt-az mounts can have tracking too though, and/or manual slow motion controls may be sufficient). If there isn’t enough space/width for a tripod on the balcony, I would go for a tabletop mounting of some sort (example, a "tabletop Dob" or maybe even better, a Maksutov with a base that can be set on a tabletop).

 

Regarding telescope type, if it were me, I’d probably get an ED doublet refractor with an FPL-53, FCD-100, FPL-55, etc. or equivalent "SD" glass element, of about 4" size (approximately 100mm) in aperture, but it could be in a range from 3" to 5". Breaking that down, this would be 3" [about 76mm, usually 72mm or 80mm] to 5" [about 127mm] depending on whether you value more having compact lightweight convenience (3") or having light gathering and resolution (5"), or want a good compromise between the two (4"). When I was living in a city apartment, I went with a 72mm on a carbon fiber tripod, but that was because I couldn’t view from the balcony — I had to take the telescope outside each time (and then back in again later). If I only had to move it a few steps to an easy-to-access balcony, I would have gone bigger, probably 4". At 5", budget can start becoming a factor, not to mention cool down time (though the extra aperture would be nice). 

 

Speaking of budget, refractors cost extra for a given aperture. Going with a simple, fully manual alt-az mounting would help greatly with the total budget, but if you haven’t found yourself particularly drawn to a refractor and are set on getting a driven equatorial mount, maybe a less expensive design-per-size would be better (ex., a Mak, or perhaps SCT, or, going in a different direction for most-aperture-per-money, a tabletop Dob).
 

Unless you have a quite large apartment or live alone, I personally wouldn’t go bigger than an 8" SCT.

 

Of course, you will know your own circumstances as well as wants/needs best, so just throwing some thoughts out there from my own observing style and past circumstances. Best of luck and success however you decide to proceed!

[Tulloch]

The original poster specifically said that they were only interested in visual viewing. The link you submitted is a stacked and heavily processed image that isn’t even remotely like what someone would see with the referenced scope with visual only viewing . Aperture overkill is very much a concern with bright city view viewing.

 

Tim

Sure, but here is a snippet from his original post...

 

...

Here are my criteria:

    Budget: $4000 excluding eyepieces (I already own a few)

    Use: Visual only: Moon and planets, possibly the Sun if possible. If it supports astrophotography then great, otherwise nevermind, I mostly want to do visual.

    Mount: Equatorial for comfort, and possibly motorized for even more convenience

    Maintenance: Low. I enjoy making some adjustments, but I’m not particularly handy

...

I reckon he'll get bored after a month of so of just viewing, and he did leave the door (slightly) ajar for future imaging possibilities 

[bobhen]

Paris is 49-degrees north with hot summers and cold winters. Seeing in the city can also add additional challenges. For imaging, most of these challenges can be overcome in post processing. So, an 8" to 9.25" SCT would be a solid choice.

 

However, if visual is your main interest, then acclimation, seeing, optical quality and light efficiency (contrast) are top priorities.

 

For visual, I would suggest a top quality 100 -120mm apo refractor. There are many to select from. From Takahashi doublets and triplets to Chinese-sourced refractors of good quality and with lower price tags. The will all ride on light to medium duty GEMs. Just pick one that meets your needs and budget.

 

Bob

[Look at the sky 101]

Use: Visual only: Moon and planets, possibly the Sun if possible. If it supports astrophotography then great, otherwise nevermind, I mostly want to do visual.

 

I suggest a good, high-quality refractor; a 4-inch one will be more than enough for your needs.
Very practical and easy to handle in a confined space.
It cools very quickly.

Edited by Look at the sky 101, 14 June 2025 - 08:27 AM.

[izar187]

Another vote for an SCT, Mak or short tube newt, +/- 6" in aperture, on a tracking mount.

Compact in size for on the balcony, more resolution than 4" or less scopes, no chromatic aberration.

The original poster spoke of tracking, and tracking is a big deal for planets and the Moon.  : )

Cooling on the SCT or Mak options can be handled by reflectix insulation on the tube, per folks with SCT's.

 

IMHO only, based upon my early experiences with a 4" short tube newt on an apartment balcony.

Short compact tube ergonomics are great in that circumstances.

Other peoples scopes that track, are tremendously advantaged for relaxed observing.

Lots more planetary detail is resolvable beyond 4".

Edited by izar187, 14 June 2025 - 11:28 AM.

[lwbehney]

First, I would agree with others that an Alt/Az mount would be best for a narrow balcony with a railing.  The warmer walls of your building facing south might create seeing disturbances close to the balcony. This is where a refractor can be of great benefit, because the objective will be farther from the disturbed air of your building. My opinion is that in your circumstances the Panther Lite mount might be ideal, because it has a special counterweight, which can balance the heavy objective of the refractor so that you can slide the telescope forwards in the saddle. This allows you to have a much smaller movement on the eyepiece of your refractor and thus requires much less space on your narrow balcony.  A review of the convenience of this mount for viewing planets and other targets is here in cloudy nights. 

Regarding which refractor to choose - The TS f/6 six inch refractor got glowing reviews by another CN contributor, who was also limited in his choices by his balcony views. The Panther Lite mount, might be able to allow the use of an f/8 six inch refractor. 

[rhannequin]

16 replies in less than 24, this is definetely a great and active community, thanks all!

 

I saw some questions in the replies so let me add a bit of context:

• do you have access to the roof by elevator or stairs? Or is observing from your balcony your plan?
  • I don't have access, I can only observe from my balcony
• it would help alot to know your logistics (accessibility, where are you planning to store gear, are you able to leave tripod (+mount) outside over day etc.).
  • That's a bit harder to tell because I haven't moved here yet. The gear would stay at home for sure, although I don't know if can can leave it on the balcony all day/year. There's no balcony above, so it would need to be incredibly well protected against humidity, heat, cold and wind.
• There are balconies and then there are balconies — how wide is yours and how high is the railing or wall surrounding it?
  • Here's a link to a picture of how the balcony is: https://gist.github....f6-87f867387bb9. It is only 1.2m in length, however it might be a bit better to put the gear in the angle. But indeed, I can't use my 12" reflector there as the eyepiece will likely be in the void. It's not much space, it's my constraint as at least it will enable me to enjoy astronomy way more often.
• Unless you have a quite large apartment or live alone, I personally wouldn’t go bigger than an 8" SCT.
  • I don't have a large apartment and I don't live alone. However, although I don't really want to store something that would bother my family, my close-ones know this is my main hobby and it would be acceptable to leave it inside constantly.
• I reckon he'll get bored after a month of so of just viewing
  • While I'm always interested in discovering new techniques and new ways to enjoy astronomy, to be honest it will probably take some time before I'm bored because I'm currently so frustrated not to be able to use my telescope and there are so many things on the Moon, the Sun and the planets I want to witness. And I like also this hobby to share it with my friends and family. Also the weather is usually not great in Paris, so it's not like I'm going to do it every day. But again, if it doesn't hurt to leave the door open to astrophotography, why not
• if tracking is important to you, which it may well be for planetary
  • I might be overthinking it but I remember having to constantly move the telescope when looking at Mars and Saturn, and often losing them. I enjoy the manual mount but more for the deep sky objects, where part of the enjoyment is the hunt on the vast celestial sphere. I feel like "hunting" planets is less a thing, but I might be wrong. After all, I'm still not that experienced in all this.

 

Thanks again to all of you for the answers and advice, happy to keep the conversation going and keep learning!

Edited by rhannequin, 14 June 2025 - 02:42 PM.

[briansalomon1]

Over the past 28 years, the best refractor I've used in NP101is. For lunar/planetary it's as good or better than TV102, (4" f8.6 doublet) and at a very dark site, the wide field performance is the best I've ever seen. With a front mounted etalon it's a world class H-alpha telescope, and I use mine for birding as well. It has the best focuser/drawtube of any telescope I've used.

 

For binoviewing, Maxbright II needs the 2.6 glasspath compensator.

[Jay_Reynolds_Freeman]

I spent some years living in various well-lit suburbs of San Francisco, California, all on the eastern side of the San Francisco peninsula. I have never been much of a lunar or planetary observer -- my particular interest has always been visual observation of deep-sky objects -- thus I cannot usefully address the original poster's issue. Yet in case that person retains some interest in deep-sky work, it may be appropriate to mention that based on my experience at those locations, even in brightly-lit sky, aperture is still a real win for visual observation of the deep sky. That might conceivably bias the choice of instrument toward something as large as will conveniently fit the site.

 

The sky was bright because were well-lit school sites for playing baseball and football nearby, and an equally well-lit racetrack for horse racing about 2 Km away. Nevertheless, I made pretty good use of 8- and 12-inch Dobson-mounted Newtonians for visual work there.

 

 

Clear sky ... 

[Jon Isaacs]

rhannequin:

 

Hello and to Cloudy Nights.

 

I can't really help you much, my situation is quite different.  What telescopes, if any, do you currently have?

 

Jon

[Mike Q]

A 5 inch frac on a iOptron Tri Pier with the AZMP mount.  You will even have some change left in your pocket 

[Enyo]

For city balcony viewing I would recommend a refractor, Mak or a SCT.  I spent 8 years in Japan on the 15th floor with my 5" refractor. The balcony faced SW and my front door faced NE and I would move between them depending on what I was looking at.  As others have mentioned a newtonian has the mirror low down and it is good to have the objective high. 

 

 

Attached Thumbnails

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[therealdmt]

…

• There are balconies and then there are balconies — how wide is yours and how high is the railing or wall surrounding it?
  • Here's a link to a picture of how the balcony is: https://gist.github....f6-87f867387bb9. It is only 1.2m in length, however it might be a bit better to put the gear in the angle. But indeed, I can't use my 12" reflector there as the eyepiece will likely be in the void. It's not much space, it's my constraint as at least it will enable me to enjoy astronomy way more often

…

Your link to your balcony photo didn’t seem to work, at least for me.

 

Among other possible options, you can post a photo directly into a post on the forum here on Cloudy Nights (like Enyo did in the post immediately above this post), though there is a bit of a learning curve to it (click ‘More Reply Options’ next to the ‘Post’ button and start trying to figure it out. Perhaps unfortunately, the Cloudy Nights forum software doesn’t automatically resize photos for posting online, so you have to do it yourself. On a Windows computer, Microsoft Paint is a free program that can do it, or on an iPhone, you can just choose image size as ‘Medium’ when selecting the desired picture from your photo library. It seems tedious at first, but after you do it a few times it starts to become easy).

 

Anyway, lots to chew over with all the possible telescope options!

[ABQJeff]

I was going to say a Cat like SCT or MCT, but then you listed Solar.

That means a refractor so you can do Solar H-a. I would say a Tak TSA-120 or AT 130 EDX F/7 triplet on an Alt/az GoTo mount with a Quark. Those will give you awesome planetary, lunar, double star and Solar-Ha.