17 replies to this topic

[paul]

Hi
I was not at the star party but 2 friends of mine were, and they said that the burms and new gate actually have made little to no improvement!
As a matter of fact that said the gate change has actually made it worse! As cars pull up to the gate in the dark their lights shine right on the field!! Also
Car lights still shine over top of the burms.
Hard to believe that this is the case
But as I said they saw it first hand

[plunk111]

All true - I was there...

[George N]

Hi
I was not at the star party but 2 friends of mine were, and they said that the burms and new gate actually have made little to no improvement!
As a matter of fact that said the gate change has actually made it worse! As cars pull up to the gate in the dark their lights shine right on the field!! Also
Car lights still shine over top of the burms.
Hard to believe that this is the case
But as I said they saw it first hand

 

So..... more opportunities to improve!  

 

The enhancements were mainly intended to stop headlights onto the field when people left the short-term area going out the wrong way - right across the road from the old gate. As they waited to turn onto the highway their headlights would go right onto the astro field. Now, that entrance/exit is closed they have to leave from the far exit. Are there still people somehow exiting the Northside directly across from the astro field?

 

Much of the actual $$ was spent improving the northside for "events" like the woodsmen show, and the "new" star parties.

 

I guess I'll have to see it to fully understand, but -- if the berms are not high enough - perhaps the Dark Sky Fund can cover additional fencing on top?

 

Why would anyone drive up to the "gate" (new one or old one?) at night? People staying at hotels parking just outside the gate and driving past the gate when leaving? Perhaps the Park needs to consider a gate move or movable sign at the new entrance. Or maybe not allowing parking outside the new gate at night? It was my understanding that that parking area was included to meet the needs of people wanting to use the Forest Industry Trail -- and required by the State.

 

Are people driving up to the old gate area at night? Might need some rocks or trees there.

 

There will always be the impact of cars driving past on the highway. That's part of "the deal" with using this Park. It's just a part of the location and the "fun" of observing from Cherry Springs.

Edited by George N, 24 June 2025 - 09:32 AM.

[Rich_W]

 

Why would anyone drive up to the "gate" (new one or old one?) at night? People staying at hotels parking just outside the gate and driving past the gate when leaving? Perhaps the Park needs to consider a gate move or movable sign at the new entrance. Or maybe not allowing parking outside the new gate at night? It was my understanding that that parking area was included to meet the needs of people wanting to use the Forest Industry Trail -- and required by the State.

 

 

On that subject of parking, I wasn't able to get there this year, but in previous years, if my wife was with me we would park the truck across the road so we could then end up in a hotel room in town after observing (she's not up to camping).   Does the new layout allow a practical and safe way to do that?  I wouldn't see walking down the road all the way to the "new" short-term entrance to be a good idea. And it sounds like parking in the area outside the new gate is a problem for the field.   Any insight from those who have been there would be appreciated.

[paul]

Hi George, 

My buddy said several cars an hour pulled into the driveway and up to the gate. maybe they thought that was a way into the field or they made a mistake thinking it was the public lot.

[Domerman]

I was there and there were many people that drive up to the gate. Signage is lacking although seeing any signs at night would be difficult without illumination.

[Skywatchr]

Why would anyone drive up to the "gate" (new one or old one?) at night? 

 

Are people driving up to the old gate area at night? Might need some rocks or trees there.

 

 

Because they are idiots.  

 

Yes, a barrier is needed so nobody can pull in, and batten boards on the fence to cover the seams.
 

[Tsb1948]

For me, Cherry Springs was foremost a motorcycle destination.  From home I can two lane it all the way with some of the best cycle roads in Pennsylvania.  With no reservations needed, I could pick a weather pleasant day no matter the moon phase.  Full moon was actually kind of fun.  No flashlight needed and no crowds.  Sometimes nobody but me.  I battled weather for some of the star parties and it's just not fun or safe.

 

But those days are now over.  No more cycle adventures to a great destination.  I'll still make a car trip or two each year and I hope the changes they made will benefit all users of the park.  Twenty-five bucks is still a deal for water, power and good cans.

 

I bought a Dwrflab 3 and hope to give it some dark skies in July or August.

Stay positive and clear skies. 

[Dave Mitsky]

I can attest to the fact that cars pulled up to the gate with headlights blasting.  I assume it was people who thought that it was the entrance to the public area. 

 

Headlights on vehicles heading down East Fork Road were also visible.

[George N]

I can attest to the fact that cars pulled up to the gate with headlights blasting.  I assume it was people who thought that it was the entrance to the public area. 

 

Headlights on vehicles heading down East Fork Road were also visible.

 

Well, that is pretty 'bad news'.......  

 

It is my (limited) understanding that the new gate/parking arrangement resulted from concerns about non-astronomers and the use of the "Forest Industry Trail" (yes it DOES have a support constituency). The concern was someone parking there to use the trail (and other connected trails) - returning at dark to find they were 'trapped' inside a closed gate.

 

I'm not seeing that gate being moved - now, or in the future. Maybe a new 'plastic curtain, like the old gate, can be installed - to block headlights of anyone at the gate?  I believe that the signage is not fully installed as yet. Perhaps a giant sign at the start of the road in "No nighttime access!- Do not enter after dark!!" would work? Or maybe it is just 'the curious' or locals wanting to see what is going on. Thanks to CSSP being on all the Weather Channel and newspaper lists of "10 best dark sky sites" -- the Saturday night programs on the Northside have pulled in as many as 2,500 people!

 

Over the years -- I've met plenty of 'locals', and Northside campers, who have the habit of walking onto the astro field and begging views at big Dobs! At one time the Park even encouraged it. One time - at Fez's for breakfast three 'college kid girls' kept talking to my friend and I - not recognizing them I said "Do we know you?" One smiled and said "We were at your telescope last night for about 3 hours!" -- They were a local college student and her friends at home for a weekend. Another time -- mid-week, my friend and I had about 10 'college kids' who were on an extended "road trip" for a few weeks - which included camping on the "North Side" - with the specific idea of walking onto the Astro Field to beg views thru big scopes and discuss "life, etc" with "the astronomers".  << It reminded me of my own college summer years! >> I know plenty of 'night voices' that I can't connect with an actual face!

 

The issue of cars heading West has always been an issue at Cherry Springs. Coming up that hill their headlight beams go right over the Park. My worst experience - in October - at least 50 'gas fracking trucks' were parked along the road at the Park. Around midnight they all started up and formed a convoy heading out. It took 20 to 30 minutes for them all to clear the area - and another hour for my night vision to come back.

 

It's still better than anyplace else I can get to within an hour or three of driving...... 

Edited by George N, 26 June 2025 - 12:35 PM.

[Domerman]

Well, that is pretty 'bad news'.......

It is my (limited) understanding that the new gate/parking arrangement resulted from concerns about non-astronomers and the use of the "Forest Industry Trail" (yes it DOES have a support constituency). The concern was someone parking there to use the trail (and other connected trails) - returning at dark to find they were 'trapped' inside a closed gate.

I'm not seeing that gate being moved - now, or in the future. Maybe a new 'plastic curtain, like the old gate, can be installed - to block headlights of anyone at the gate? I believe that the signage is not fully installed as yet. Perhaps a giant sign at the start of the road in "No nighttime access!- Do not enter after dark!!" would work? Or maybe it is just 'the curious' or locals wanting to see what is going on. Thanks to CSSP being on all the Weather Channel and newspaper lists of "10 best dark sky sites" -- the Saturday night programs on the Northside have pulled in as many as 2,500 people!

Over the years -- I've met plenty of 'locals', and Northside campers, who have the habit of walking onto the astro field and begging views at big Dobs! At one time the Park even encouraged it. One time - at Fez's for breakfast three 'college kid girls' kept talking to my friend and I - not recognizing them I said "Do we know you?" One smiled and said "We were at your telescope last night for about 3 hours!" -- They were a local college student and her friends at home for a weekend. Another time -- mid-week, my friend and I had about 10 'college kids' who were on an extended "road trip" for a few weeks - which included camping on the "North Side" - with the specific idea of walking onto the Astro Field to beg views thru big scopes and discuss "life, etc" with "the astronomers". << It reminded me of my own college summer years! >> I know plenty of 'night voices' that I can't connect with an actual face!

The issue of cars heading West has always been an issue at Cherry Springs. Coming up that hill their headlight beams go right over the Park. My worst experience - in October - at least 50 'gas fracking trucks' were parked along the road at the Park. Around midnight they all started up and formed a convoy heading out. It took 20 to 30 minutes for them all to clear the area - and another hour for my night vision to come back.

It's still better than anyplace else I can get to within an hour or three of driving......

You are absolutely right that cherry springs is still awesome and in my opinion well worth $25/night. I do wholeheartedly agree that such signage you reference would be very welcome.

[vicuna]

So as for the parking across the street, the rangers said the way the parking lots are laid out now if you are looking for a spot the way you drive up and down shines your headlights on the astronomy field.

 

they said they have current and funded plans to put more spaces that run perpendicular…said they didn’t get to it due to weather but it’s in the budget and in the works. So when that’s done there will be less of that.

 

the berm stops headlights from anyone pulling into the new Astro field parking lot. If they pass the parking lot and get to the gate, then yeah the berm doesn’t do anything. 

 

Perhaps a sign at the entrance of some sort…or a DO NOT PASS HERE AFTER DARK sign of some sort for people who don’t know. Or at least a “put your headlights on low past this point” sign?

 

the problem is you can pass the parking lot if you dunno what your’e looking for or you’re on the wrong side or something.

 

for someone who just drives in and parks, the berm stops those headlights. So to say they do nothing is completely incorrect. (But there are indeed other headlights from other directions).

[vicuna]

Also I know most of you are really good with maps and roads and stuff. But I am horrible at it and I know other people like me exist. I get lost all the time if I’m not using google maps.

 

for people like me, the signage is not ultra clear. There were temp signs that said “Star Party” - but if I was there looking for my campground for the first time, that’s not something that would make me think that’s the wrong spot. Like if it’s someone’s birthday party, I would not think I can’t still go and find my camping spot. 

 

I doubt any lay person knows the lengths some of us go to to get dark adapted.

 

the signage just needs to improve AND when people sign up for a camping spot, perhaps they can get a one sentence notice about not going to the Astro field by accident with your lights on because it’s disruptive. (Put nicer)

 

I doubt anyone is doing anything on purpose.

[Dave Mitsky]

I wonder when the DCNR maps for Cherry Springs State Park will be updated.

 

https://elibrary.dcn...HSP_ParkMap.pdf

 

https://elibrary.dcn...P_ParkGuide.pdf

[Phillip Creed]

With the additions to the public area, how viable is the public (north) side of the park for imaging/observing if you're planning on staying in town vs. what it was before?

Clear Skies,

Phil

[andreww71]

With the additions to the public area, how viable is the public (north) side of the park for imaging/observing if you're planning on staying in town vs. what it was before?

Clear Skies,

Phil

Phil,

 

Larry M. took a number of images of the new facilities on the north side of the road. It looks like he's been out on the summer star party circuit and hasn't published his images with descriptions in his typical PDF digest format yet. You can see his images on his web page: https://www.stellar-...rtypictures.htm, Cherry Springs Star Party 2025. Images 16 thru 24 give you a pretty good look at the new facilities. I would think that headlights from cars entering and leaving the parking lot as well as any stray lights from the campground would be the biggest issues. And, of course, whatever surprises a field full of general public brings

 

I was at CSSP on 04/27 of this year. I squeezed in one good night of springtime galaxy observing. Like every other time that I have been to CSSP, this one was not without incident!

 

I set up on the southwest section of the field, roughly due west of Nova Ave. Between me and the tall grass along the edge of the field, a young couple set up a small tent and looked to be trying to be there unnoticed. The ranger came by shortly after 6 pm and after discovering that they did not have any astronomy equipment, gave them the boot. The young man asked me if I had a pair of binoculars he could borrow but I did not. I don't know if he believed me but nonetheless he and his friend packed up their stuff and left. I saw them back on the field, this time east of me, not long after that with a small tripod outside their tent.

 

Sometime late in evening twilight I think someone managed to pull onto the astronomy field. All I know is that it sounded like an angry mob was gathering on the northwest end of the field. I clearly saw headlights flashing and heard lots of yelling.

 

From where I was set up, I would occasionally get flashed by headlights from cars turning around in the public lot while observing near the zenith with my scope. Observing near the zenith puts my eye about 7 feet off the ground. The next day I pulled into the pubic area and walked around. I could clearly see across the road onto the astronomy field from the north end of the lot. There are earth mounds placed in a few spots between the north lot and route 44 but they are not continuous.

 

I don't go to CSSP with expectations that everything will be perfect. As long as the weather cooperates, I can work around most everything else. 

 

Andrew

Edited by andreww71, 06 July 2025 - 03:52 AM.

[Larry Mc]

Phil,

 

Larry M. took a number of images of the new facilities on the north side of the road. It looks like he's been out on the summer star party circuit and hasn't published his images with descriptions in his typical PDF digest format yet. You can see his images on his web page: https://www.stellar-...rtypictures.htm, Cherry Springs Star Party 2025. Images 16 thru 24 give you a pretty good look at the new facilities. 

 

hi all, you can find my CSSP 2025 report now online. see this posting: https://www.cloudyni...025/?p=14204472

To answer Phil's question, I think the remodeled public side will be good for short visual/imaging sessions. Just remember, you still have to cart your equipment in from the public parking lot, and no sleeping overnight on the public field or in your car.

[George N]

.......

I was at CSSP on 04/27 of this year. I squeezed in one good night of springtime galaxy observing. Like every other time that I have been to CSSP, this one was not without incident!

 

I set up on the southwest section of the field, roughly due west of Nova Ave. Between me and the tall grass along the edge of the field, a young couple set up a small tent and looked to be trying to be there unnoticed. The ranger came by shortly after 6 pm and after discovering that they did not have any astronomy equipment, gave them the boot. The young man asked me if I had a pair of binoculars he could borrow but I did not. I don't know if he believed me but nonetheless he and his friend packed up their stuff and left. I saw them back on the field, this time east of me, not long after that with a small tripod outside their tent.

 

Sometime late in evening twilight I think someone managed to pull onto the astronomy field. ...... 

 

Andrew

People have been trying to "game the system" with Astronomy Field camping for years. At least with the new fee structure there's not much value in being there (unless the North side campsites are full). I've seen motorcycle campers sneek onto the Astro Field at dusk and leave at dawn - I doubt that they paid anything. The new gate set up is not fully complete I believe - and the sign set-up should discourage people from mistakenly driving into the South side trail parking area (hopefully -- or the State needs to do something). Also - with the new spending - there will be more Ranger coverage.

 

One time on off-time on the Astro Field a large group of people set up right next to me. They were from India (living in Washington DC) - and were aware of the "rules". Their "astronomy equipment" for about 30 people (men, women, kids) was a single - never out of the box before - 4.25" inch Newt on a tiny GEM. They had it set up totally wrong - I showed them how to do it. However, their real "astro interest" was -- two of the guys had high-end DSLR or Mirrorless cameras on tripods and knew what they were doing to take "Milky Way" wide-fields, etc. All but 3 of the men when to bed about a  half-hour after dark, they had red flashlights, respected the rules -- but it was odd being up my ladder at the eyepiece of my 20-inch F/5 Dob listining to a bunch of people speaking in Bengali somewhere close in the dark! 

 

I'm hoping and expecting (hopefully ) that as the new "improvements" settle in respect for the "rules" will improve on the AstroField - and additional work will help with lights from the Northside. A few bucks donated from the Dark Sky Fund people and their work days - could add some blocking fence at the top of the berms.

 

Personally - I will probably continue with my "pandemic and later" practice of mostly being at the park mid-week, none-star party periods. October can be beautiful - but also below freezing late night.

Edited by George N, Today, 12:14 PM.