16 replies to this topic

[A. Viegas]

Just a question. There is no way I can build an observatory close to the house. There is plenty of land available from .5 to a few acres I can buy anywhere from 20 to a 100 miles from the house. So this would be to build a basic roll off and I don’t really care about grid power as I can install a few panels and run all the power locally. Don’t need any facilities and I can probably use a cell modem for uplink.

Of course. There is the inevitable risk of theft and damage. Also I plan to operate it all remotely. So of course a part of me says why have the hassle when I can co-locate in some Astro village in the US southwest or even in the Southern Hemisphere.. but I like to tinker and well want to have a relatively close location. Lastly, I can just wait 5-10 more years and then sell the house and buy something that fits the observatory requirements.

Just wondering if anyone has done this half-way solution and bought nearby land to build an observatory? Worth it or not?

Al

[macdonjh]

Our local astronomy club has a dark sky site approximately one hundred miles from my house.  When they opened a part of that site to members for building personal observatories I accepted their offer.  My observatory is for visual only, and has no remote control features (yet).  It has absolutely been worthwhile if for no other reason than it gave me a project in building it and another a few months ago to remodel it.  It's also very satisfying to have my main gear fully set up and ready to go within ten minutes of my arrival.  The part which takes the longest is getting all the covers off my scope and mount.

[Sleep Deprived]

Our local astronomy club has a dark sky site approximately one hundred miles from my house.  When they opened a part of that site to members for building personal observatories I accepted their offer.  My observatory is for visual only, and has no remote control features (yet).  It has absolutely been worthwhile if for no other reason than it gave me a project in building it and another a few months ago to remodel it.  It's also very satisfying to have my main gear fully set up and ready to go within ten minutes of my arrival.  The part which takes the longest is getting all the covers off my scope and mount.

I am curious - is this anywhere near people?  Are you worried about security?  How well-locked are your observatories on the site?  If I put my shoulder into it, could I break down the door?  

 

Security would be my big worry.  I was a kid once, and it was 'fun' to go places where I shouldn't - no vandalism, or anything like that, but not all kids stop at having fun going places that they shouldn't.

[macdonjh]

There hasn't been any trouble at the club site in the fifteen years I've been going there.  Not even now with the observatories.  I think all the club members have a concern, but we don't let it deter us, obviously.  Personally I don't worry too much about theft, but like you, I do worry about vandalism.  But nothing's happened so far.  Knock on wood.

[weis14]

I've considered doing this at some point in the future.  There are large areas with Bortle 2 or 3 skies around 100-150 miles north of me.  Most of it is heavily wooded, so to get access I'd need to own some land and cut enough of the forest back to open a clearing.  

 

Right now, I have two young kids and I don't want to have to travel for observing.  However, that will eventually change and open up the possibilities for an observatory somewhere "up north."  If I really had what I wanted, I'd find a spot that was near a river or lake and buy a cabin too.  That would be great for sleeping over after a session and allow for use by the wife and kids as well.  

 

In your situation, the best thing that you could do in my opinion would be to buy insurance that covers the value of your items.  If you have something particularly rare or valuable, I'd take it home with you if you are worried.  Just having the observatory and pier/mount set up and ready to go would greatly simplify things.

[starzonesteve]

I found a nice place 70 miles from me in Bortle 2-3 country that had a small cabin on it already. I cleared a few acres and built a ROR observatory. I love it but I have been broken into twice in three years. I now have security doors and windows, motion detecting lights and cameras, and am waiting for StarLink so that I can set up an alarm that I can respond to in real time.

 

I love the place - especially the ability to set up so quickly and easily. I am busy with work and family but I see being able to spend more time out there in the future. I think if you can find a suitable place then grab it and take the time you need to execute a plan that will work for your observing preferences.

[Phil Sherman]

Setting up a remote observatory can be a lot more complicated than you initially think. You need to plan on getting to the site at least once every three months after the first year of operation which will require more frequent visits. A location 20-25 miles away will be a lot easier to get to than one that's 200 miles away. My primary remote observatory that's around 1900 miles from home has been down for a few months due to a computer failure that can't be fixed on site despite having a full OS backup for it located there. It'll be back in service after I ship a new OS for the computer.

 

Many years ago, my observatory partner and I were running the building through a cellular modem. Service was marginally adequate and not inexpensive.

 

Good luck with your choice of solutions.

[GoFish]

Do not underestimate the expense and effort of clearing land and building access roads.  Oh, yeah, and maintaining that cleared land 

 

I ended up buying a house and mostly wooded land in a Bortle 4 zone.  A year later, I’ve pushed the trees back away from the lawn a little to give me a more or less 30 degree horizon. I’m experienced with a chain saw and small tractor, but no way could I have handled doing the tree clearing myself. Just the cleanup after the cutting/chipping was done took me weeks with the tractor and landscape rake. 
 

I am just now finally to the point of installing a permanent pier, with an observatory on the back burner. 
 

One more thing:  if you do buy land and do the prep and maintenance work yourself, you will be ready for bed at sundown .  Personal experience. 

[A. Viegas]

Thanks everyone for the advice. I still have many years to further develop this plan. Buying into a hosted site is the easiest choice but it would negate my requirement for tinkering. I do AP and planetary but mostly I enjoy the tinkering and experimenting with equipment/ setups and new tech and processes. If all I wanted was to download big data sets then that would require a dark sky location and a hosted site. For now that is less interesting. Of course I can just wait another 5 or so years and sell the house and move someplace more Astro friendly.

Covid has really brought to focus how much our lives are trade offs of immediate satisfaction versus delayed gratification. With kids in college and medical school it just pushes out our future plans and then of course you start to worry about retirement and with all of that you need to remain healthy too…. Alas…. The only solace is knowing that eventually we may get to the promised land!

[MHamburg]

Hello Al,

First I see that you are in the AAA. I was a member a bunch of years ago when I first became a docent at the AMNH. Secondly, I see that part of your profile lists CT as a location. Do you have a place there and is it suitable for an observatory?

My primary home is in Brooklyn but I had bought land in the Berkshires in 1975 and subsequently built a house and before too long I realized what dark skies we had. So after tiring of wet star charts and mosquitos, I built an observatory and never looked back. It is 160 miles from Brooklyn but once I'm here what a convenience! My sole complaint is that it is cloudy too much of the year.

 

Michael

[A. Viegas]

Hi Michael

Come back to the club! We have a lot going on and our classes are great too, and so easy to take as they are on zoom now!

I am in northwestern ct. unfortunately I bought the house many years ago in a HOA before i understood what that would mean for my astronomy hobby! So I can’t build any structure. I keep three of my scopes outside covered by telegizmo covers 24/7 all year long but alas I cannot remote into them when I am in the city, that is why I want to build an observatory so I can operate the scopes remotely when I am not there.

[MHamburg]

Hi Al

What does the HOA say about outbuildings?

 

Michael

[A. Viegas]

Hi Michael

HOA approval process is tiresome. You have to make it match house/style and obtain approval for any freestanding structure. Besides the HOA hassle I also have a limited patch of sky due to trees and large hill directly to north and north east and northwest

So overall it’s not really a location suited for astronomy… but I try anyhow!

[Lead_Weight]

Check your homeowners insurance to see if they will cover it. Mine does. There might also be a local insurer (near the site) that would also insure you, so good to look around.

[pretyro]

   Is it common/possible to rent access to a spot?   Someone that lives on a 5 acre lot might be willing to rent you access  to setup your observatory.  The advantage is that the homeowner can provide some nominal security.  Although the observatory might not be in line of sight of the homeowner's house, at least the site is not wholly secluded.

[Ettu]

Imo, the best is to build something on a piece of land of a friend.

You should be able to work out something that is A LOT cheaper than a purpose hosted site.

Even if it's only 1 or 2 Bortle better than at your home, it's usually worth it. Even if it's a step to something better later.

Importantly however, even if, especially if, a friend, it should be done on a strict business basis, so there are no unspoken presumptions - on either side - that could become problems.

The next best (imo) is on someone's rural residence. Ranked in order from my experience would be:  A working farm, a retiree's residence, a rural rental home property.

They all have their potential pitfalls and issues. But again, arrangements can usually be worked out that mean a lot less $ for you, and as well, something in Their pocket that they didn't have before, at little or no cost or inconvenience to them.

It's maybe not socially easy to cold call on someone to ask if they'd be open to such a thought, but in my experience, almost without exception the initial responses range between intrigued to enthusiastic. Yes, surprisingly, sometimes enthusiastic.

The best way to build up a relationship with someone, - and to see if you think there is a possibility here - is to ask to set up your rig on their property, and invite them to come and see, and then do a little star party for them, and their friends. Sit down with them afterwards and show them your pictures and what you do.

Give it a go.

Edited by Ettu, 06 December 2021 - 01:19 PM.

[Am33r]

Hi

 

I wish you best with your venture.  I have acceptable skies in my town and no high-rise buildings, so I wanted to buy a piece of land and build a professional observatory.  I needed land that the public can access, and it should have a real entryway and a parking lot because my observatory will be used as a business, so not any remote vacant piece of land would do.  Nevertheless, I needed land.

 

There is the option of asking a little remote church or a winery if they will allow you to place your observatory as an accessory on the edge of their property; sure, you can pay a little rent rather than buy land since you don't need much space.

 

I ended up - given my usage - buying a parking lot here in my town; I even paid for it in full.

 

I suggest you get a Shipping Container (even a 10' one will do) that is modified for your use with a roll off top.

 

I'm not allowed to use the image here, but type in office shipping container in your search engine and look at the images. It's amazing what you can do with those.

 

I am leaning towards using a larger shipping container for an office that has other scopes, etc., and my metal Observadome as the main observation structure.  They are both secure, and I think a shipping container will be great for you especially if you get a 20' one that has a 10' top rolling onto the other 10' - you can even install a little bathroom connected to a little septic tank there!

Edited by Am33r, 08 December 2021 - 04:54 AM.